Mile High FI Podcast

JL Collins joins Carl and Doug to talk about a terrible investment experience with Real Estate. JL tells the story in his new book, How I Lost Money in Real Estate Before It Was Fashionable: A Cautionary Tale.

You probably recognize JL from our other talk with him, or more likely the Google Talk, or his first book, The Simple Path to Wealth. JL is amazing!

🔥 Check out his new book on Amazon [Affiliate Link so we get a commission if you buy it. thanks!]

🔥 How I Lost Money in Real Estate Before It Was Fashionable

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In this episode, Doug and Carl interview “Purple” from the blog, A Purple Life. Purple worked for nine years in the marketing industry and then retired early at age 30 to relax and enjoy life in her prime.

Here are a few highlights from our discussion.

– Purple’s work situation
– Quitting work in your prime
– Going back to work?
– Learning about FI
– Life in retirement
– Travel
– Calming down
– Purple’s perfect day

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Doug and Carl interview Michael Quan from Financially Alert. Michael blogs over at Financially Alert, and recently published a book The F.I.R.E. Planner, which you can find on Amazon or at Barnes and Noble!

Special Note! Leave a YouTube comment or join our email list for a chance to win Michael’s book:

Join the MILE HIGH FI CLUB

Opening: Michael talks about some childhood experiences with fire, the bad kind!

Discussion

• Growing up with awesome financial role models
• Financially Alert blog: Michael’s “why” and the decision to share his net worth
• Starting and selling a business
• Real estate: long and short-term rentals

The FIRE Planner, Michael’s new book

• Why write a book?
• Income versus growth investing
• The incredible value of resourcefulness
• Finding good people to spend your time with
• Luxury cars?
• Are early retirees who work truly retired?

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This week’s episode is short but packs a punch!

From the floor of the FinCon expo hall, Doug and Carl interview blogging legend JD Roth of Get Rich Slowly. JD has been in the FI community since its earliest days in the early 2000s. His very successful site has been inspiring readers to save money and get their financial lives on track for over a decade. Here are a few highlights from our discussion:

• JD shares a recent purchase that is decidedly NOT frugal
• JD’s experience growing up with parents who weren’t good with money
• JD’s early money mistakes
• Starting Get Rich Slowly, selling it, and buying it back
• Where the FI movement is going

We were so psyched to be able to talk with JD and we hope you’ll be inspired by his words of wisdom!

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★ Let’s hang out at the EconoMe Conference! ★

Carl is speaking at EconoMe and Doug is attending. You can save 10% by using this coupon code: 1500

*Affiliate link so we get a commission if you buy something.

In this episode, Doug and Carl interview Lauren and Steven from Trip Of A Lifestyle. Steven and Lauren are a married couple who retired at just 29! He is a former high school teacher and she worked in marketing. Although neither of them ever made more than six figures in income, they were still able to retire ultra early and take a couple of trips that lasted over six months along the way.

Their story is truly inspiring. Here are a few highlights of our discussion:

• Steven bails on grad school
• Living in Hawaii for really, really cheap
• The huge advantage of keeping your expenses low
• The joy of the inverted workweek
• Their trip to 63 national parks, including their favorite (Death Valley)
• Taking a break long enough to forget your old life
• Carl and Steven debate paying off a mortgage

Links

• About Us – Trip Of A Lifestyle
• How We Took a 6-Month Hawaii Honeymoon for $0
• Buying a $4,500 Car with Ramen Noodles
• Lauren and Steve’s Episode on The Doug Show: Launching a Blog in a Competitive Niche and Getting Press Coverage | Trip of a Lifestyle – DS282
• Lauren and Steven recommend The Simple Path to Wealth by JL Collins

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★ Let’s hang out at the EconoMe Conference! ★

Carl is speaking at EconoMe and Doug is attending. You can save 10% by using this coupon code: 1500

*Affiliate link so we get a commission if you buy something.

In this episode, Doug and Carl interview Amberly Grant, creator of FinTalks (formerly FinZoom) and all-around-awesome human. Here are a few highlights of our discussion:

• How Amberly met Mr. Money Mustache
• FinTalks: something great born out of a place of depression
• Unexpected adventures
• The future of FinTalks

Travel

• Ottawa to LA to NYC to Ottawa to Thailand
• Finding local connections
• Escaping a bad situation
• Favorite places
• Safety when traveling alone

Real estate

• What a house is to Amberly
• Leveraging your network

Amberly’s perfect day

• Keeping busy
• HIIT
• The joy of being productive

Links:

• Rich Dad Poor Dad by Robert Kiyosaki
• The Wealthy Barber, Everyone’s Commonsense Guide to Becoming Financially Independent by David Chilton
• The Simple Path to Wealth by JL Collins
• ChooseFI: Your Blueprint to Financial Independence by Chris Mamula, Brad Barrett, and Jonathan Mendonsa
• Go Natural English (teaching English abroad)
• Amberly’s Website
• Amberly’s Facebook

Meet Amberly

When we think of Amberly Grant, just one thing comes to mind: energy! This girl is on the go and passionate about her many pursuits. Amberly is (deep breath): an avid traveler, teacher, reader, real estate investor, business school graduate, and Senior Project Manager at a tech company. And she speaks four languages! She loves to achieve and lives to help others.

Recently, Amberly channeled her love of all things personal finance and her extroversion by creating an online group of people who get together weekly to discuss life and money. This group, known as FinTalks (formerly FinZoom) is a space for people to share what they’ve learned about finances and help others share and grow in their FI journeys. If you’re interested in being part of this free and awesome group, check it out and let Amberly know!

Our Discussion

We started out by talking to Amberly about how she got involved in the personal finance space and how she first met Pete (Mr. Money Mustache). She then told us all about the origins of FinTalks. Amberly was going through a difficult time. She was going through a breakup … just as COVID was hitting. Being trapped in lockdown after a rough breakup would be hard on anyone. But Amberly knows that the best way to grow and get out of a rut is to focus on helping others. So she started FinTalks!

On top of that, Amberly started making Facebook Live presentations, where she would distill complex finance topics into easily digestible nuggets of wisdom. Even though she started slow, Amberly’s dedication caused her presentations to steadily grow in popularity.

We then delved into Amberly’s background and how she first became interested in personal finance. Like many of our guests, she watched her parents struggle with poverty and vowed that her life would be different. In fact, she set the intention very early in life that she would be a millionaire one day. She talked to us about the personal finance books she started reading at age 15 (!) and how it set her off on a course to success.

Amberly then talked to us about her love of travel, which was inspired by her love of reading. Amberly always remembered the places she had read about and wanted to see them in person herself. She also loves nothing more than challenging herself, and travel is part of that. Amberly travels mostly alone, and she has some great tips for other solo travelers (especially women). She loves to immerse herself in a new culture and make new friends on the fly. Some of her travel highlights include bike-packing trips across the Pacific Northwest and some late nights partying in Thailand while she taught English there.

We also asked Amberly about her perfect day and week. Because she loves to stay so busy and enjoys her work, her work would definitely be a part of it. We also discussed the psychology of staying busy and why it’s also important to slow things down.

Finally, Amberly talked to us about her real estate investing strategy. Amberly never wants to pay her own mortgage and has set up her life to ensure she doesn’t have to! She also let us in on her plans for a new property management company, which is in the works.

We hope you get inspired by our conversation with Amberly. We know we did!

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★ Let’s hang out at the EconoMe Conference! ★

Carl is speaking at EconoMe and Doug is attending. You can save 10% by using this coupon code: 1500

*Affiliate link so we get a commission if you buy something.

In this episode, Doug and Carl talk to Joel Larsgaard from the How To Money Podcast. Here are a few highlights of our discussion:

• Frugal versus cheap! Joel discusses a time when he went cheap and it didn’t garner him any fans
• How Joel’s childhood (including a car repossession) shaped his money habits
• Real estate investing (6 rentals with more on the way!)
• Investing in stocks
• Working for money legend Clark Howard
• How To Money
• Joel’s perfect day

Links

Rich living on less money – How to Money

 

The Clark Howard Show: Podcasts Archives Meet Joel Larsgaard

Joel Larsgaard is a guy who’s living out his dream life and wants to help you live yours, too. He has been in the personal finance and media space for many years. Before starting his own podcast, he worked with Clark Howard on his syndicated radio show, The Clark Howard Show.

Although Clark is now retired from radio, he still puts out a successful podcast, which talks about all things money-related and to empower consumers. And since parting ways with Clark, Joel now runs his own podcast, How to Money, with his best friend, Matt.

Joel and Matt love helping people take control of their finances and, of course, getting to work with each other. Working on the podcast with a half-mile commute each day to his best friend’s house (which he does on bike, of course), is a dream come true for him and gives him the freedom to enjoy life and spend time with his wife and kids.

Our Discussion

We started out discussing the fine line between frugal and cheap. Joel told us a story about a time when he purchased some ceiling fans just because they were inexpensive. They were the wrong size and poor quality, and left Joel frustrated that he would spend more time and money in the long run – eventually having to replace them with ones that actually did the job. Frugal doesn’t always mean spending less money on things!

We then delved into Joel’s backstory with money. Like Carl, Joel grew up with parents who were not great with money. They spent money they believed they’d have as soon as Joel’s dad was promoted. But that promotion never came through, and Joel watched as his parents struggled to afford the things they needed and wanted in life.

A particularly vivid memory for him is watching a new Dodge Durango that his parents had purchased get taken away by “the repo man.” Joel vowed that he would never let himself struggle with money, and became radically frugal in response. Now, he thinks about money as not just something that has to be scrimped and saved but as a powerful tool that can help you bring your dreams into reality.

Joel talked to us about how his own siblings think about money, and how he is working to teach his children now about finances. His philosophy is that just because he has money doesn’t mean he’s spending it on whatever the kids want. He is instilling in them the importance of working hard for the things you want and the power of saving towards bigger purchases.

We then picked Joel’s brain about real estate investing. Joel owns six rental properties right now – all in his home town of Atlanta. He intentionally invests only in properties near where he lives because he knows the area so well and feels confident about the direction of certain neighborhoods. He only buys properties he would live in himself, and has found that being a landlord isn’t nearly the headache it’s cracked up to be if you do it wisely.

He expects to own about 12 properties one day and then call it quits. This led us to the discussion of knowing when enough is enough. Goalposts are always moving  in life. But we all agreed that it’s valuable to have a small handful of things in life that you would always be happy to spend more money on, and to be content with simplicity in everything else.

Joel, for example, owns only one car for his family. And that’s more than enough for them.Even if you gave Joel a giant pile of money, he wouldn’t buy another car or upgrade the one they have. He’s happy with simplicity when it comes to his cars. But he’s always happy to spend a bit more when it comes to things that really make him happy: craft beer, vacations, and folk art.

Finally, Joel told us a little bit about his work with the famous Clark Howard (turns out he’s as nice as he seems on the radio), and his own podcast How to Money. Joel learned a lot in the first 30-50 episodes and talked about how he and Matt found their voice.

We are so grateful Joel shared his insights with us and we hope you’ll enjoy listening to our conversation!

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★ Let’s hang out at the EconoMe Conference! ★

Carl is speaking at EconoMe and Doug is attending. You can save 10% by using this coupon code: 1500

*Affiliate link so we get a commission if you buy something.

 

 

 

 

 

 

In another listener mailbag show, Doug and Carl answer more questions.

– Roxanne asks: If your financial independence (FI) journey was a movie, which one would it be? (check out Roxanne’s YouTube Channel)
– David asks: What are your favorite travel rewards cards?

The conversation then gets serious. Doug and Carl discuss questions from Twitter user Mindspeaks:

• How does one stop focusing on FI and start focusing on life?
• I came from a lower-middle-class household and had extended family who mocked our money situation. This scarred me.
• I could have started saving in 2009, but I spent recklessly instead. How do I forgive myself for these mistakes?
• I am stuck at my job because of a work visa. What do I do?
• Money can’t buy happiness, but it can buy freedom. What is your experience with money post-FI?

Of course, there is a little asparagus talk too.

Links:

• Rewards credit cards
• Trip Of A Lifestyle
• Rebel Entrepreneur Podcast
• California Asparagus Commission

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★ Let’s hang out at the EconoMe Conference! ★

Carl is speaking at EconoMe and Doug is attending. You can save 10% by using this coupon code: 1500

Doug and Carl interview Eddie and Travis from Downshift Financial. Downshift is a fee-only financial planning firm. Here are some highlights of our discussion:

• Would you accept a free steak if you had to listen to horrible financial advice?
• The 10 questions you need to ask any financial planner
• The only guaranteed investment: annuities (and why they’re a bad choice for most)
• The 4% Rule and early retirees
• Why many planners don’t have your best interest in mind
• The challenges of financial planning for early retirees
• The drivers of economic growth
• VTSAX: Is it all it’s cracked up to be?
• Carl’s hatred of dividend investing
• Eddie and Travis’s FIREy lives
• Downshift Financial’s client engagement methodology

Links:

• Bogleheads Investing Advice and Info
• Vanguard on International Investing
• Financial Advisors for Early Retirement – Downshift Financial

Meet Eddie and Travis  Eddie Liang and Travis Hughes are friends and business partners who, though technically FI, are pursuing their passion to help others through their financial planning firm, Downshift Financial. Eddie and Travis know just how predatory many financial advisors can be. In fact, they got into this line of work because they wanted to help people who need financial advice get what they need while avoiding those kinds of predatory practices. Eddie and Travis’s fee model is completely transparent and above-board. They charge a flat fee for their services. Period! You won’t find them pitching you any individual stocks or annuities or other opaque, suspicious products that benefit the financial advisor far more than the client. They believe in index funds and simply try to help their clients find the best asset allocation that works for them. They’ll also help with other critical things like optimizing a client’s tax strategy, reviewing an estate plan, and making sure other financial items (like college savings, estimated tax payments, tax loss and gain harvesting, and many others) don’t fall through the cracks. Our Discussion  Right out of the gate, Eddie and Travis told us about some of the bad experiences they’ve had with financial advisors in the past. That includes the ever-popular “free” steak dinner that comes with an aggressive sales pitch. Eddie and Travis try to avoid exactly this kind of approach. They also talked to us about the critical difference between fee-based and fee-only advisors, and why fee-based advisors can be sketchy. Also – fun fact, financial advisors are free to be a little cagey about their commissions. They then walked us through what questions everyone should ask a financial advisor before signing on with them. Those include: (1) Are you fee-only? (2) Are you a fiduciary at all times or a broker, as well? (3) Does your firm engage in sales contests or awards programs? We then delved into some more FIRE-y topics. Eddie and Travis talked to us about how they aim to serve the FI community and discussed their take on the 4% rule. We also discussed how they feel about going 100% into VTSAX. Turns out, they take a more global approach and value diversification into international stocks. But you won’t find them bad-mouthing VTSAX, either. They are still big believers in American index funds, as well. We discussed dividend investing and why Eddie and Travis aren’t big fans (neither is Carl!). That darn F-word (flexibility! get your mind out of the gutter, guys) came up again. Eddie and Travis are big fans of building lots of flexibility into their lives. After a brief foray into the mechanics of getting money out of retirement accounts before you hit retirement age, we wrapped things up by having Eddie and Travis tell us some more detail about what Downshift Financial offers. Eddie and Travis are building something truly amazing – a financial planning firm that is transparent, above-board, and focused entirely on serving client needs. We hope you enjoy our conversation with them and check out Downshift Financial to see if they can help you keep your financial house in tip-top shape!

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★ Let’s hang out at the EconoMe Conference! ★

Carl is speaking at EconoMe and Doug is attending. You can save 10% by using this coupon code: 1500

*Affiliate link so we get a commission if you buy something.

 

 

 

 

Hold onto your hats, friends! Things are off the chain this week – not only is this a surprise bonus episode, we are also coming at you with the undisputed king of the FI movement: Mr. Money Mustache.

This episode is a recording of a Q&A that took place at The Extraordinary Event  put on by our last guest – Alan Donegan! The Q&A covered a range of topics, but here are a few highlights:

• When Pete started Mr. Money Mustache, did he expect it would be the phenomenon that it is?
• Alan, Carl, and Pete discuss what’s next for them
• Morning routines (or lack thereof)
• Internal barriers to FI
• Is the prospect of making money still motivating?
• How to convince a partner to get on board with FI
• Surprises about FI life

Mr. Money Mustache Headquarters

Katie and Alan Donegan’s Many Enterprises:

• Rebel Finance School
• Rebel Business School
• Alan Donegan’s Podcast
• Alan Donegan’s Blog

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★ Let’s hang out at the EconoMe Conference! ★

Carl is speaking at EconoMe and Doug is attending. You can save 10% by using this coupon code: 1500

Carl met Alan and Katie Donegan in Ecuador at one of JL Collins’s Chautauquas in 2016. They’ve been friends ever since. In this interview, we discuss:

• Alan’s childhood struggles
• How to build confidence
• Family trauma
• Rebel Business School
• Discovering FIRE
• Real estate
• Becoming digital nomads
• The Donegans’ perfect day

Meet Alan and Katie 

Katie and Alan are an accomplished, fun-loving couple who have taken the world by storm with their radical approach to starting a business. Alan was someone who yearned to start his own business but was vehemently opposed to the idea of taking on debt to do it. Thus, The Rebel Business School was born.

Through the courses taught at Rebel Business School, Alan began teaching people how to launch businesses without taking on any debt. To Alan, the phrase “you’ve got to spend money to make money” is sheer bunk.

Both his own successful businesses and the many businesses started by students of The Rebel Business School are proof of it. Katie is a former consultant who left behind the corporate world after achieving Financial Independence. She and Alan now work on The Rebel Business School together.

They also put out a podcast, write a blog, and run the Rebel Finance School, which helps teach people both the basics and the advanced aspects of attaining financial success.

This couple is ambitious about teaching, helping others, and loving life. They are now full-time digital nomads – a feat they managed successfully even during COVID-19!

Our Discussion 

We kicked things off with something that felt pretty basic – we asked Alan and Katie to introduce themselves. But Alan reminded us that this can actually be quite tricky when you’re “retired” early and can’t simply rattle off your name and a one-word description of what you do all day.

We then took a dive into the deep end and talked about overcoming bullies in childhood. Although Katie’s wit and penchant for sports kept her from being bullied, Alan faced some difficult hurdles in his youth – but the wisdom he now takes away from those early challenges is nothing short of inspiring.

Alan told us about how he has learned to build confidence over the years and how helpful it is to go into any situation thinking about how things could go right, instead of getting stuck in a negative feedback loop of fearing how things could go wrong. Alan now thinks to himself: “What if I went into this room full of people and found an amazing friend or an exciting new opportunity”? We also went in depth about public speaking.

Carl, Doug, and Alan have all had very positive experiences with Toastmasters and view it as an incredibly powerful confidence-building tool. Alan also highly recommends Presentation Zen by Garr Reynolds and Craig Valentine’s 52 Speaking Tips for fine-tuning your presentation and PowerPoint skills.

We then talked in depth about the Rebel Business School. Alan is passionate about debunking the myth that starting a business requires debt, and that passion shines through.

We discussed some of the success stories from his business and how the school got started. Alan also told us about the power of taking action – right now!

He’s seen so many of his students in the school who want results but hesitate in making the critical moves that would get them there.

Katie and Alan then told us how they discovered the FIRE movement. Like many people, their introduction came through blogs. But Alan was also inspired by Tony Robbins’ book Notes From a Friend, which set him on a path towards better financial decision-making.

After becoming enamored of the concept of financial independence, Katie and Alan began looking at others all around them and wishing they could help them make better financial choices. So they took action! They started the Rebel Finance School to help people get to full financial literacy and hopefully pursue a path towards financial independence themselves.

We wrapped things up by going full circle – back to Alan’s story of his childhood bullies. When asked what he’d say to that bully today, Alan had the best possible answer: he’d simply move on. He no longer has any need to impress anyone or live life on anyone’s terms but his and Katie’s. That’s a pretty powerful way to live your life!

Alan and Katie were excellent guests, and we highly recommend you check out their courses, their blog, and their podcast! You’ll walk away with an armload of wisdom, and an earful of their delightful English accents!

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★ Let’s hang out at the EconoMe Conference! ★

Carl is speaking at EconoMe and Doug is attending. You can save 10% by using this coupon code: 1500

*Affiliate link so we get a commission if you buy something.

Doug and Carl interview Sarah and Ray, also known as Waffles On Wednesday. They discuss:

• The $36,000 bar tab
• Sarah’s Why of FI: Travel
• Ray’s Why of FI: Options
• Taking a 6-month trip to see the world
• Going back to work

Meet Ray and Sarah

Sarah (an occupational therapist) and Ray (a tech worker) are a travel-loving, beer-loving, fun-loving couple who have visited more than thirty countries and leveraged the power of financial independence to take a six-month sabbatical traveling all over the globe. In addition to their jobs and running the blog Waffles on Wednesday, they are now parents to a baby girl and have chosen to continue working despite the strength of their financial position.

Our Discussion with Ray and Sarah 

Ray and Sarah started by telling us the story of the $36,000 bar tab. After discovering the concept of FI, Ray started taking a hard look at their spending trends over the last years. In reviewing a previous year’s credit card transactions, he did the math and realized they had spent a whopping $36,000 in a single year at bars. At the time, Ray and Sarah were living in Los Angeles, with a nice apartment that had a view of the beach. And they were going out to eat and drink virtually every night. But seeing the final tally for all that spending was a wake-up call. They moved to a more modest apartment, began learning how to cook better food at home, and cut back on their nights out. But for Sarah, it took some convincing to cut back on spending because she absolutely loves her job and always has. Sarah owns her own occupational therapy business and loves both her work with young children and the feeling of being an entrepreneur. So the concept of cutting back at first seemed like deprivation for no good reason. Ray, meanwhile, needed no convincing as he didn’t love his tech gig and was craving flexibility and more control over his day-to-day life.

Instead of butting heads at an impasse, Ray and Sarah talked deeply about what they wanted out of life. Ray found a blog post he thought Sarah might like about how financial independence could lead to a life of full-time travel. And that caught Sarah’s attention. Sarah is a lifelong learner and has always loved getting to experience other cultures, other styles of work and food and dress and communication. So when she realized that saving money meant more travel, she was all in. In other words, Ray and Sarah thought carefully about their “why of FI” and found a common love that motivated them both to work towards a life full of frugality, but also travel and adventure. As a result of their hard work and dedication, Ray and Sarah were able to flex their financial muscles and take a six-month sabbatical to travel the world in 2019.

We talked with Ray and Sarah about which countries they visited, heard some fun stories related to their mutual love of beer, and then finally told us about re-entering the world of work after returning home. Ray was offered a job at a prestigious company that he felt he couldn’t turn down. Sarah has continued her occupational therapy work. She has even discovered in a post-COVID world that she can do her therapy remotely, giving her even greater flexibility. We also talked about the COVID-induced dip in the stock market, and how much better off FI folks were in that situation than those who had never focused on saving or frugality. We wrapped things up by discussing Sarah’s business and the couple’s advice for people toying with the idea of working towards FI. Their advice? Do it. Even if you love your job! You might not love your work forever, and even if you do, the flexibility and freedom to be able to step away when or if you want to is priceless.

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★ Let’s hang out at the EconoMe Conference! ★

Carl is speaking at EconoMe and Doug is attending. You can save 10% by using this coupon code: 1500

*Affiliate link so we get a commission if you buy something.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Doug and Carl interview Chris, the “Indiana Jones” of the FI community. Chris worked in the startup world before leaving to pursue a series of bucket-list adventures including:

• An archeological dig for a dinosaur
• Diving for treasure in the Florida keys
• Learning Muay Thai kickboxing
• Writing a screenplay
• Recording an album

Meet Chris from Life Outside the Maze 

The Financial Independence community has been sorely lacking in treasure hunters and archeologists … until now! Chris, who blogs over at lifeoutsidethemaze.com is someone who gives careful thought to what he wants out of life. After working in the start-up world for most of his career, he and his wife had saved up enough to feel comfortable working for happiness instead of financial gain. But since leaving behind formal work, he has been anything but lazy. Chris brainstormed a list of dozens of  goals he wanted to achieve, experiences he wanted to have, and adventures he wanted to challenge himself with. To  create his epic list, Chris looked back to his childhood loves and then far beyond. So far, he has helped uncover one of the world’s most complete torosaurs, found right here in Colorado, dived for sunken treasure, learned Muay Thai kickboxing, written a screenplay, recorded an album, visited dozens of national parks, climbed Long’s Peak in Rocky Mountain National Park, and he’s done it all while raising two boys. Chris is truly someone to look to for inspiration if you are struggling with boredom in a post-FI life or if you wonder how you’ll fill your days once you do hit FI.

Our Discussion with Chris 

We had so much to cover with Chris, but we were able to discuss a few of his fascinating adventures in our short time. Chris told us his origin story and how he first began to think seriously about fulfillment when a successful venture capitalist (with a net worth of roughly half a billion dollars) warned Chris that he’d be no happier once he became truly rich. This comment made Chris question his path forward in life, and he and his wife began rethinking their focus and saving. Chris also told us that the first time he walked away from life, he struggled with boredom and depression and eventually went back to work. When Chris felt ready to walk away a second time, he did so with a plan. He created a structure for himself and made a list of adventures and goals he wanted to tackle in life. We delved into the psychology of leaving work behind and how boredom can actually create space for creativity.

We then waded into the specifics of Chris’s “bucket list” – a term he uses with hesitation. Chris thinks of it as a life list – things he wants to challenge himself with and enjoy along the way and not something to be mindlessly checked off as we near the end of our time on Earth. But whatever the name for it, Chris’s list of dreams he hopes to achieve (and has already achieved) is nothing short of inspiring. He talked to us about how he became an amateur archeologist, how he got connected with a treasure-diving enterprise, gave us the goods on the coming-of-age story screenplay he’s been working on, talked about his life-long love of music and the album he’s been creating, and his many outdoor adventures. Chris also told us about how he became connected to the FI community and his investing strategy. We also talked about the teaching and mentoring Chris has done, and wrapped things up with a brief discussion of home-brewing.

We hope you enjoy hearing about Chris’s many adventures and that it inspires you to make your own list of dreams and get started living them!

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★ Let’s hang out at the EconoMe Conference! ★

Carl is speaking at EconoMe and Doug is attending. You can save 10% by using this coupon code: 1500

*Affiliate link so we get a commission if you buy something.

Doug and Carl interview Kristen Rainey. Kristen is an amazing human who graduated from Princeton, taught in Indonesia, hiked the Appalachian Trail, worked at Google, and so much more. In this episode, Kristen discusses:

• Spending a week cut off from technology in Katmai National Park
• Grizzly bears!
• Holding individual stocks
• Moving to Bozeman Montana
• Implementing effective behavioral change while working at Google and beyond
• Intermittent fasting
• Enhancing your life through travel
• Happiness

→ Check for Northstar Sleep School spots in Sept 2021.

Meet Kristen Rainey 

We’d have to write a novel to even scratch the surface of Kristen Rainey’s life. She is accomplished, well-read, well-studied, well-traveled, and so much more. She attended Princeton University, where she received a bachelor’s degree in art and archeology, and later Cornell, where she obtained an MBA in Management, and finally Tufts University, where she studied International Business and the Global Food Sector. She has held a high-powered corporate position at Google in the food sector, where she put her skills to work helping Google employees make smarter food choices, among many other responsibilities. On top of all that, she’s an entrepreneur. She’s started her own business related to food sustainability and is currently the founder and CEO of Northstar Sleep School, which helps people live better and healthier lives by improving the qualify of their sleep. She hosts the podcast Northstar Unplugged, and blogs about all things sleep-related, as well.

Impressed yet? We haven’t even begun to scratch the surface! Kristen is also quite the world-traveler, and has lived in more than a dozen places, including Indonesia, Paris, Milan, Sri Lanka, Thailand, Morocco, Santa Fe, New York, Lake Tahoe, Bozeman, Portland, White Salmon, and Mexico. She speaks multiple languages and is also an avid skate skier, paddle-boarder, hiker, and swimmer, to name just a few of her athletic pursuits. And did we mention that she’s thru-hiked the Appalachian Trail? No big deal. Just an epic backpacking trip of roughly 2,200 continuous miles.

If there’s something Kristen hasn’t done or can’t do, we’ve yet to discover it.

Our Discussion with Kristen

Having someone with this many interests, passions, and accomplishments on the show is a challenge because there are so many things to cover in so little time! But here are a few topics we managed to squeeze in.

Kristen’s Recent Backpacking Trip in Alaska and the Power of Unplugging 

We began by discussing her recent 8-day backpacking trip in Alaska. (Be sure to check out the grizzly bear cam of the bears in Brooks Falls, where Kristen went.) Kristen told us about the awesome experience of seeing 47 grizzly bears (47!) chowing down on salmon. We also explored the power of unplugging completely for 8 days straight and discussed generally the importance of unplugging regularly, even when you’re not out in the wilderness.

Financial Independence,  Stock Picking (gasp!), and AirBnB Hosting 

We then moved on to financial independence and Kristen’s choice to be (mostly) a stock picker rather than an index-fund disciple. She told us about how she has tried to balance accomplishment with happiness in her life. As you can tell from her resumé, she has erred on the side of accomplishment and has trouble making time to truly relax. She talks about her experience hosting AirBnBs and how it can be downright frantic sometimes. She also discusses what life is like in Bozeman, Montana and how she ended up choosing to live there (out of the many places she’s visited and considered living).

Habit Changes and Intermittent Fasting

Kristen offered us some insight into what she learned at Google about how to help people change their food habits. Even just making the “bad stuff” a little harder to get to can have a huge effect. We also discussed intermittent fasting and the health benefits it can have beyond just burning fat. And we explored tips for those interested in intermittent fasting who have yet to give it a try.

Traveling and the Struggle to Choose from the Buffet of Life

Kristen examines how her travels have shaped her. She tells us how, through travel, she has become more open-minded and appreciative of other cultures and experiences, how thru-hiking the Appalachian Trail taught her the value of traveling light, and how she got to know herself better through travel and learn that she truly values down time to recharge on her own. We also delved into the difficulty of saying no and how to choose from the many options life has to offer. Kristen recommends the book Essentialism: The Disciplined Pursuit of Less by Greg McKeown.

We loved chatting with Kristen and hope you enjoy listening, as well. And when you head over to check out Kristen’s website, make sure to give a listen to Kristen’s interview of Carl on her podcast!

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★ Let’s hang out at the EconoMe Conference! ★

Carl is speaking at EconoMe and Doug is attending. You can save 10% by using this coupon code: 1500

*Affiliate link so we get a commission if you buy something.

Doug and Carl discuss hiking, guitars, and upcoming conferences they’ll be attending including FInCon and EconoMe. They also discuss their recent adventures at Camp FI. Then it’s time to answer some questions (and respond to hate mail) from the listeners. Topics covered include:

• What phone apps do you like?
• What are your favorite podcasts?
• Where does your money go after you die?
• Do you include your home in your 4% Rule calculations?
• How does inflation affect the 4% rule?
• When withdrawing money from your investment portfolio in retirement, should you take a year’s worth of expenses out at a time? Or is it smarter to take it in smaller chunks?
• And much more!

Links:

• Lex Fridman: Lex Fridman Podcast – Lex Fridman
• Tim Ferris (Rolf Potts): Rolf Potts on Travel Tactics, Creating Time Wealth, and Lateral Thinking (#41 & #42)
• Tim Ferris (Arnold Schwarzenegger): Tim Ferriss Interviews Arnold Schwarzenegger on Psychological Warfare (And Much More) (#60)
• Huberman Lab: https://hubermanlab.com/
• Tropical MBA: The Podcast for Location Independent Entrepreneurs
• FinCon: finconexpo.com
• EconoMe Conference: economeconference.com (discount code below)

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★ Let’s hang out at the EconoMe Conference! ★

Carl is speaking at EconoMe and Doug is attending. You can save 10% by using this coupon code: 1500

*Affiliate link so we get a commission if you buy something.

Meet M.K. Williams

In Episode 17 of the Mile High FI Podcast, Doug and Carl talk to M.K. Williams, who is both an accomplished author herself and a coach who works with other authors to help them launch their books out into the world.

She has her own YouTube channel and her own website, both dedicated to teaching authors about the nitty gritty details of what to do after finishing a book (and some motivating tips to actually finish that book in the first place!).

She covers everything from how to self publish, how to market, how to narrate your own audiobook, and what tools work well for authors. Her sites are truly a treasure trove for you if you’re already an author or have ambitions to one day put fingers to keys and write your own book!

She also discusses how to run your own side hustle. M.K. actually had hers in progress before she pulled away from her corporate career. She left her corporate job on a Friday, and began diligently pursuing her passion projects full-time the next Monday!

M.K.’s Passion for FI 

Did we mention that M.K. and her husband are also financially independent? M.K. has been part of the FI community for nearly eight years, and she has lots of insight into how to reach the promised land of financial independence.

She also talks about what her own Post-FI life looks like, and why for so many of us, FI doesn’t mean leaving work behind altogether but on finding work you’re passionate about and would do for free.

We discuss the “Internet Retirement Police” and why, for M.K. she just doesn’t care what anyone else thinks – she and her family are living their best life, and for them, that means continuing to pursue passion projects (which actually make money!) and even traditional work for her husband, because he genuinely loves his job.

M.K. also discusses her love for FI, but also notes how she has moved away from completely associating her identity with it. After automating their finances and hitting their FI number, they no longer have to dedicate as much mental bandwidth to money. They are free to refocus that energy into other interests and dreams.

Balancing it All With a Baby Girl

M.K. and her husband have a baby girl (almost eight months old now) and she talks about the balance of raising an infant while still writing her own books and building her online business that focuses on helping other authors succeed.

We delved deep into the power of FI and not having to get up and go to the office daily when you have a little one who needs you basically every minute that she’s not asleep.

We wrap things up by discussing whether financial independence has improved M.K.’s overall happiness and whether FI is achievable for anyone. Hope you enjoy this episode and be sure to check out all of M.K.’s great resources for writers!

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★ Let’s hang out at the EconoMe Conference! ★

Carl is speaking at EconoMe and Doug is attending. You can save 10% by using this coupon code: 1500

*Affiliate link so we get a commission if you buy something.

Doug and Carl interview Stephen Baughier, the creator of Camp FI. They discuss:

• The creation of Camp FI
• The importance of community
• Future Camp FIs

 

Camp FI – Highly recommended! Go if you can…

 

Join the Mile High FI Club – It’s our email list!

★ Let’s hang out at the EconoMe Conference! ★

Carl is speaking at EconoMe and Doug is attending. You can save 10% by using this coupon code: 1500

*Affiliate link so we get a commission if you buy something.

Doug and Carl host a panel of three guests and answer audience questions at Camp FI Rocky Mountain. Also on the stage are Lynn (FI Healthcare), Ray (Waffles On Wednesday), and Josh.

• Lynn talks about financially taking care of relatives
• Ray goes down a rabbit hole talking about rabbit holes
• The pros and cons of two-ply toilet paper
• Carl learns a new word: “manscaping”
• And much, much more.

Links:

• Camp FI – Highly recommended! Go if you can…
• FI Healthcare – Lynn’s Site about Health Care options
• Waffles on Wednesday – Ray’s Blog

Join the Mile High FI Club – It’s our email list!

★ Let’s hang out at the EconoMe Conference! ★

Carl is speaking at EconoMe and you can save 10% by using this coupon code: 1500

*Affiliate link so we get a commission if you buy something.

 

Doug and Carl interview Diania Merriam, creator of the EconoMe conference.

Diania discusses:

• Discovering Mr. Money Mustache and getting out of $30,000 in debt
• Using creativity to adopt a frugal lifestyle
• Lessons learned (and not learned!) while hiking the El Camino Trail
• How financial independence allowed her to leave a toxic situation
• The merits of quitting work even before you’re done saving
• The real purpose of setting goals
• The EconoMe conference

Links:

• EconoMe Conference 2021 – Save with Code “1500”
  *Affiliate Link so I earn a commission if you use the code. Thank you!
• Optimal Finance Daily
• The Miracle Morning
• Tim Urban: Taming the Mammoth
• Mr Money Mustache: News Flash: Your Debt is an Emergency!!

★ Let’s hang out at the EconoMe Conference! ★

Carl is speaking at EconoMe and you can save 10% by using this coupon code: 1500

*Affiliate link so we get a commission if you buy something.

Doug and Carl talk to Matt Giovanisci. Matt created a wildly successful lifestyle business and shares the numbers in this interview.

Matt is a marketing expert and practitioner, but so much more.

In this interview, Matt discusses:

• Skipping college (except for a failed 2 weeks)
• Writing, performing, and producing his own music
• Teaching himself to write code to develop websites
• Why he quit an incredibly successful podcast

Passion mashing Links

• Swim University
• MoneyLab
• Matt’s pool-maintenance rap video on YouTube

 

★ Let’s hang out at the EconoMe Conference! ★

Carl is speaking at EconoMe and you can save 10% by using this coupon code: 1500

*Affiliate link so we get a commission if you buy something.

Doug and Carl interview Carla and Robert. Carla was a big law attorney who was unhappy with her career, so changed things up. Her husband Robert loved his job but still stepped away for a sabbatical.

In this interview, you’ll learn how they navigated evolving careers and goals.

Topics:

• Clerking for a federal judge a high-powered career in big law
• Hiking the Pacific Coast trail including the repercussions of eating 60 Chicken McNuggets
• Carla and Roberts’ introduction to FI (Robert needed a little convincing)
• Mini-sabbaticals and Misty Gold cars
• The incredible value of flexibility

 

★ Let’s hang out at the EconoMe Conference! ★

Carl is speaking at EconoMe and you can save 10% by using this coupon code: 1500

*Affiliate link so we get a commission if you buy something.

Doug and Carl each share 5 of their favorite life hacks. Somehow, the conversation veers into cat cafes and another less reputable business.

Mentioned during the recording:

• Wait But Why: Taming the Mammoth
• Huberman Lab: Master Your Sleep
• Email batching with Boomerang
• Stanford study on creativity

 

★ Let’s hang out at the EconoMe Conference! ★

Carl is speaking at EconoMe and you can save 10% by using this coupon code: 1500

*Affiliate link so we get a commission if you buy something.

 

Doug and Carl talk about:

• the state of the housing market
• their vastly different housing situations
• whether owning a home is a good idea.

Doug and Carl also talk about why living in a van down by the river isn’t what it used to be. Finally, Carl threatens to move into Doug’s basement.

★ Let’s hang out at the EconoMe Conference! ★

Carl is speaking at EconoMe and you can save 10% by using this coupon code: 1500

*Affiliate link so we get a commission if you buy something.

 

Carl discusses the effects of his recent trip to Mexico.

Doug talks about a recent brewery excursion.

Doug and Carl then answer reader questions involving cryptocurrency, portfolio balancing, spending, and Doug’s latest investment.

At some point, the show devolves into a discussion about asparagus pee.

★ Let’s hang out at the EconoMe Conference! ★

Carl is speaking at EconoMe and you can save 10% by using this coupon code: 1500

*Affiliate link so we get a commission if you buy something.

Get off your ass. Yes, we’re talking to you. In this episode, Doug and Carl discuss the value of learning new skills and pursuing new projects. This leads to a discussion on how you should leverage your strengths. Finally, they talk about some side hustles including Doug’s OnlyFans account.

★ Let’s hang out at the EconoMe Conference! ★

Carl is speaking at EconoMe and you can save 10% by using this coupon code: 1500

*Affiliate link so we get a commission if you buy something.

Humans spend a lot of money on transportation, especially personal vehicles. In this episode, Doug and Carl discuss their cars and associated expenses. Carl thinks he’s frugal and is surprised by how much he has spent. They also discuss the new versus used debate, how Doug got a great deal on a car, and the future of transportation.

★ Let’s hang out at the EconoMe Conference! ★

Carl is speaking at EconoMe and you can save 10% by using this coupon code: 1500

*Affiliate link so we get a commission if you buy something.

 

Will a life of FIRE lead to happiness? Maybe.

But it’s not what you think. In this episode, Carl and Doug talk about what makes humans happy, how FIRE will (or will not lead to happiness), and the tumultuous tale of an early retiree.

★ Let’s hang out at the EconoMe Conference! ★

Carl is speaking at EconoMe and you can save 10% by using this coupon code: 1500

*Affiliate link so we get a commission if you buy something.

 

The FIRE Movement is fraught with misunderstanding and confusion. In this episode, Carl and Doug talk about some of the misconceptions around FIRE.

★ Let’s hang out at the EconoMe Conference! ★

Carl is speaking at EconoMe and you can save 10% by using this coupon code: 1500

*Affiliate link so we get a commission if you buy something.

**Disclaimer: The podcast is for informational purposes. Maybe entertainment but we won’t even make such a claim. You shouldn’t take the info as financial, legal, or tax advice. We aren’t certified financial planners or advisors. We’re not qualified for much. So get advice from professionals.**

In this episode, Doug and Carl interview Mindy Jensen, Carl’s wife! Mindy and Carl talk about their first date, Carl’s unhealthy obsession with coupons, how to find a FIREy spouse, venereal diseases, and much more.

Check out Mindy’s new book, First Time Home Buyer (co-written with Scott Trench). Or her other book, How to Sell Your Home.

Connect with Mindy Jensen

• Instagram
• Twitter

★ Let’s hang out at the EconoMe Conference! ★

Carl is speaking at EconoMe and you can save 10% by using this coupon code: 1500

*Affiliate link so we get a commission if you buy something.

Resources:

• Bengen and the Trinity Study
• Further explanation of how 4% Rule is the Worst Case Scenario!
• Recent Bengen comment on the 4% Rule
• Fire Dating App – https://firedating.me/. Also, referenced on Millennial Revolution.

Few topics in the FIRE community are more controversial than the 4% Rule. In this episode, Carl and Doug discuss the history of the 4% Rule, why the rule is great, why it sucks and how you should apply it to your own journey.

Resources:

• Bengen and the Trinity Study
• Further explanation of how 4% Rule is the Worst Case Scenario!
• Recent Bengen comment on the 4% Rule

★ Let’s hang out at the EconoMe Conference! ★

Carl is speaking at EconoMe and you can save 10% by using this coupon code: 1500

*Affiliate link so we get a commission if you buy something.

Carl and Doug interview JL Collins, author of the best-selling book, The Simple Path To Wealth.

You’ll learn how JL came to love index funds and why they’re so effective. JL shares an announcement for the first time ever.

Doug and Carl also talk about their plans for The Simple Path To Wealth musical and what kind of pizza JL prefers.

• JL’s Blog
• The Simple Path to Wealth (on Amazon)
• JL on Twitter

★ Let’s hang out at the EconoMe Conference! ★

Carl is speaking at EconoMe and you can save 10% by using this coupon code: 1500

*Affiliate link so we get a commission if you buy something.

Carl and Doug talk about working with each other and why they’re doing the podcast.

Carl mentions a rowing machine from Amazon…though any model will do.

Doug was reading a Keith McCafferty book.

We record on a Zoom Podtrack P4.

★ Let’s hang out at the EconoMe Conference! ★

Carl is speaking at EconoMe and you can save 10% by using this coupon code: 1500

*Affiliate link so we get a commission if you buy something.