Just the Zoo of Us

Join Ellen & special guest, technobiologist and professor Jack Koch, for a review of the iconic crustacean known and loved by many names: the crawfish. We discuss sea hare ink, a genetically modified super-soldier kaiju battle, the taxonomic classifications of rocks, bugs and squishy bags, the perils of growing up under the tail of a cannibal mom, and so much more. 

Links:

• Learn more about Jack's work at the Aquatic Germplasm and Genetic Resources Center
• Follow LSU Research on Instagram!
• For more information about us & our podcast, head over to our website!
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Ellen lets the sand cat out of the bag. We discuss dangerously approaching Hey Arnold, refusal to poop on unfamiliar toilets, blood gushers, a myth of dirty underwear, Cat Premium, and so much more.

Works Cited:

1. “The Carnivores of West Africa” - Donovan Reginald Rosevear, 1974. Page 396
2. “Mammalian ear specializations in arid habitats: structural and functional evidence from sand cat (Felis margarita)” - G. T. Huang et al, Journal of Comparative Physiology A, June 2002
3. “Sand cat in Iran - present status, distribution and conservation challenges” - Taher Ghadirian et al., CATnews (newsletter of the IUCN’s Cat Specialist Group), 2016
4. "Sand Cat" - International Society of Endangered Cats (ISEC) Canada
5. “Home ranges of African sand cats (Felis margarita margarita)” - Alexander Sliwa et al., Journal of Arid Environments, March 2023
6. “Isabelline” - Paul Anthony Jones, HaggardHawks.com
7. IUCN Red List: Sand Cat (Felis margarita)
8. "DOMESTIC X SAND CAT AND PALLAS'S CAT HYBRIDS" - Sarah Hartwell, messybeast.com

Links:

• For more information about us & our podcast, head over to our website!
• Follow Just the Zoo of Us on BlueSky, Facebook, Instagram & Discord!
• Follow Ellen on Instagram or BlueSky!

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Curious about the exclusive bonus content for Maximum Fun members? Enjoy some free samples from special episodes: "All Fun and Games with Isaac," "Just the Two of Us," and Let's Learn Everything's "Frogs! II A Royal Rescue"

 If you like what you hear, head over to https://maximumfun.org/join and sign up to get access to the entire bonus content library and SO much more!

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Ellen & special guests, Ella Hubber and Tom Lum of Let’s Learn Everything, turn our gazes to the skies and talk animals in space. We discuss the fruit fly fan club, the great big farm on the moon, which earthlings were ACTUALLY the first to make the trip around the moon and back, a spider escape where you least want it, why dentistry researchers had a snake room, shooting tardigrades out of a gun, and so much more. This one is truly out of this world.

Works Cited & Further Reading:

• "Bioastronautics Research" video
• "This New Ocean: A History of Project Mercury" - Loyd S. Swenson, Jr., James M. Grimwood, Charles C. Alexander, NASA SP-4201
• "Judith's Web - Student Experiment Aboard Skylab 3" - NASA.gov
• “URODELEAN AMPHIBIANS IN STUDIES ON MICROGRAVITY: EFFECTS UPON ORGAN AND TISSUE REGENERATION” - E.N. Grigoryan et al., Adv. Space Res, 2002
• "From Undersea to Outer Space: The STS-40 Jellyfish Experiment" - NASA STI Program
• "For water bears, the glass is all full" - Tina Hesman Saey, Science News, December 2015
• "Tardigrades survive exposure to space in low Earth orbit" - K. Ingemar Jonsson et al., Current Biology, September 2008
• "What happened to those tardigrades sent to the Moon?" - Laurent Palka, The Conversation, February 2024
• "Tardigrade Survival Limits in High-Speed Impacts—Implications for Panspermia and Collection of Samples from Plumes Emitted by Ice Worlds" - Alejandra Traspas & Mark J. Burchell, Astrobiology, July 2021

Links:

• Support our shows with your membership during the MaxFunDrive!
• Check out Let's Learn Everything!
• For more information about us & our podcast, head over to our website!
• Follow Just the Zoo of Us on BlueSky, Facebook, Instagram & Discord!
• Follow Ellen on Instagram or BlueSky!

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Ellen jaws away about the great white shark. We discuss making our own planetary rings, performance-enhancing Speedos, how sharks sleep, the White Shark Café, IRL baby shark, and so much more.

Works Cited:

• “Shark evolution: a 450 million year timeline” - Josh Davis, Natural History Museum
• “SPEEDO FASTSKIN – A HISTORY OF THE WORLD’S FASTEST SWIMSUITS” - SwimSwam.com, November 2023
• “White Shark Bite Kinematics — Preliminary Exploration of a New Aspect” - R. Aidan Martin, ReefQuest Centre for Shark Research
• “An electrophysiological correlate of sleep in a shark” - John A. Lesku et al., Journal of Experimental Zoology Part A: Ecological Genetics and Physiology, July 2024
• “For five days in 1980, a great white shark named Sandy lived in Golden Gate Park” - Peter Hartlaub, San Francisco Chronicle, June 2024
• “The Great White Way” - Pete Thomas, Los Angeles Times, September 2006
• “White Shark Café: The mysterious meeting spot for great whites in the middle of the Pacific Ocean” – Sascha Pare, LiveScience, September 2024
• “First-ever sighting of a live newborn great white” - Jules Bernstein, UC Riverside, February 2024
• “Shark Management Laws” - NOAA Fisheries

Links:

• Support our podcast by joining the Maximum Fun network at maximumfun.org/join
• For more information about us & our podcast, head over to our website!
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It's MaxFunDrive. And here, for the first time, we give you an exclusive look (well, listen) at the craft of podcasting: presenting Casters on Casters.

In this episode, Teylor Smirl (Still Buffering) and Ellen Weatherford (Just the Zoo of Us) bond over the media they consumed that shaped who they are today, and how that media informs their perspectives on their shows. Plus, each host reveals their dream guest.

If this glamorous, in-depth journey into what makes your favorite hosts tick inspires you, support them by joining as a member at maximumfun.org/join.

Edited by Laura Swisher and Produced by Hannah Muroz for Maximum Fun.

Help support this show and unlock bonus content! Become a member at https://maximumfun.org/joinjustthezoo

Join Ellen & special guest, co-founder and CEO of conservation organization Wildlife SOS Kartick Satyanarayan, for a review of Asian elephants. We discuss the harm caused by wildlife exploitation, how they protect animals by uplifting human communities, how education can help tourists make more ethical choices, and of course our guest shares some stories of what it’s like living and working alongside these beautiful giants. He’s got feel-good conservation success stories, workplace comedy, an adorable baby elephant, truly what more could you want from a podcast episode?

Links:

• Learn more about Wildlife SOS's work on their website!
• See Baby Bani and more on Wildlife SOS's YouTube channel!
• Learn more about ethical tourism on RefuseToRide.org
• For more information about us & our podcast, head over to our website!
• Follow Just the Zoo of Us on BlueSky, Facebook, Instagram & Discord!
• Follow Ellen on Instagram or BlueSky!

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Follow Ellen down the jackrabbit hole. We discuss facial tilt, satellite dish ears, evolutionary ghosts of predators past, touchdown dances, jackalopes, Easter, and so much more.

Works Cited:

• "A Field Guide to Jackrabbits" - Matthew L. Miller, The Nature Conservancy, Nov 2022
• “Ecological correlates to cranial morphology in Leporids (Mammalia, Lagomorpha)” - Brian Kraatz et al., PeerJ, Dec 2014
• "Jackrabbit Gets a Touchdown!" - YouTube
• “Celebrating Easter, Christmas and their associated alien fauna” – Malene Lauritsen et al., World Archaeology, Oct 2018
• “The Shifting Baselines of the British Hare Goddess” - Luke John Murphy & Carly Ameen, Open Archaeology, August 2020
• “What Do Eggs Have To Do With Easter?” - Encyclopedia Britannica
• "Meet Jack" - City of Douglas, Wyoming's website

Links:

• Check out your local MaxFun Meetup Day - Ellen will be at the Seattle meetup!
• For more information about us & our podcast, head over to our website!
• Follow Just the Zoo of Us on BlueSky, Facebook, Instagram & Discord!
• Follow Ellen on Instagram or BlueSky!

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Join Ellen & the Cryptonaturalist (Jarod K. Anderson) to talk about the ways that nature and wildlife can inspire our creativity and shape our stories, particularly the enticingly unknowable cryptids. We discuss being raised by a witch, the natural poetry in scientific facts about starfish, the value of enthusiasm, caked up Mothman and the tragic Squonk, getting emoted on by skunks, the surprisingly complicated history of dandelions, a vulture named Potato, and so much more.

Links:

• Learn more about Jarod's work on his website
• Find Strange Animals and Jarod's other books on his Bookshop
• Follow Jarod as The Cryptonaturalist on Instagram
• Follow Jarod on Bluesky or Substack
• Check out The CryptoNaturalist Podcast
• For more information about us & our podcast, head over to our website!
• Follow Just the Zoo of Us on BlueSky, Facebook, Instagram & Discord!
• Follow Ellen on Instagram or BlueSky!

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Don't call it a comeback, coelacanth's been here for years. We discuss life on Earth 400 million years ago, a military escort mission, our own fish ancestors, five year pregnancies, underwater handstands, an unnecessarily complicated puzzle in the third generation Pokémon games, and so much more.

Works Cited:

• “The Coelacanth” - Knysna Museum
• “The Discovery” - UC Museum of Paleontology’s website
• “Earliest known coelacanth skull extends the range of anatomically modern coelacanths to the Early Devonian” - Min Zhu et al., Nature Communications, April 2012
• “Animated Life: The Living Fossil Fish | HHMI BioInteractive Video” 
• “The coelacanth rostral organ is a unique low-resolution electro-detector that facilitates the feeding strike” - Rachel M. Berquist et al., Scientific Reports, March 2015
• “New scale analyses reveal centenarian African coelacanths” - Kélig Mahé et al., Current Biology, August 2021
• “Neurocranial development of the coelacanth and the evolution of the sarcopterygian head” - Hugo Dutel et al., Nature, May 2019
• “Buoyancy and hydrostatic balance in a West Indian Ocean coelacanth Latimeria chalumnae” - Henrik Lauridsen et al., BMC Biology, August 2022

Links:

• Come hear Ellen talk about dragons LIVE at Nerd Nite Seattle! https://seattle.nerdnite.com/
• For more information about us & our podcast, head over to our website!
• Follow Just the Zoo of Us on BlueSky, Facebook, Instagram & Discord!
• Follow Ellen on Instagram or BlueSky!

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Join Ellen & Dalton Mason, creator and bird parent behind Apollo and Frens, for a look into life alongside the world-famous African grey parrot. You may have seen their videos on social media showing off Apollo’s incredibly impressive vocabulary, answering questions and even speaking in full sentences, which have earned the bird a spot in the Guinness Book of World Records in 2025 - on top of all the pistachios, of course. We discuss animal cognition and what makes parrots such great models for animal intelligence, the brain soup machine, bird-proofing a home, parrots video calling each other, and so much more.

Works Cited:

• "Birds have primate-like numbers of neurons in the forebrain" - Seweryn Olkowicz et al., PNAS, June 2016
• "Birds of a Feather Video-Flock Together: Design and Evaluation of an Agency-Based Parrot-to-Parrot Video-Calling System for Interspecies Ethical Enrichment" - Rebecca Kleinberger et al., Proceedings of the 2023 CHI Conference on Human Factors in Computing Systems, April 2023
• African Grey Parrot flight calls: Peter Boesman, XC719450. Accessible at www.xeno-canto.org/719450

Links:

• Learn more about Apollo and Frens on their website: https://apolloandfrens.com/
• Follow Apollo and Frens on YouTube, Instagram, and TikTok!
• For more information about us & our podcast, head over to our website!
• Follow Just the Zoo of Us on BlueSky, Facebook, Instagram & Discord!
• Follow Ellen on Instagram or BlueSky!

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Ellen falls in love with the Mandarin duck. We discuss why waterfowl's webbed feet don't freeze in the winter, the evolutionary arms race between male and female ducks, New York City's local celebrity Hot Duck, your new favorite coffee order, and more.

Works Cited:

1. "Countercurrent Exchange" - Dr. Roger Lederer, ornithology.org
2. “Coevolution of Male and Female Genital Morphology in Waterfowl” - Patricia L. R. Brennan et al., PLOS One, May 2007
3. "Ducks, Geese, and Swans" - Ivan Phillipsen, scienceofbirds.com, December 2020
4. “Conspecific Brood Parasitism and Nesting Biology of Mandarin Ducks (Aix galericulata) in Northeastern China” - Qiu-Ziang Deng et al., The Wilson Journal of Ornithology, September 2011
5. "Molecular Evidence for Interspecific Brood Parasitism and Successful Hatching by Mandarin Duck (Aix galericulata) on the Scaly-sided Merganser (Mergus squamatus)" - Shu Liu et al., BMC Zoology (under review Feb 2026)
6. "Will You Still Love the Hot Duck When He Looks Like This?" - Andy McGlashen, Audubon Magazine, February 2019

Links:

• For more information about us & our podcast, head over to our website!
• Follow Just the Zoo of Us on BlueSky, Facebook, Instagram & Discord!
• Follow Ellen on Instagram or BlueSky!

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Join Ellen & special guest, science communicator and Certified Bug Friend Emily, for a review of the tiny little bugs that fly around your nearest kitchen sink. We discuss what Big Pest doesn’t want you to know, convergent evolution between bugs and fish, the drain gods, secret spy languages that only bugs can read, and so much more.

Links:

• Follow Emily on Instagram, YouTube, and more!
• Learn more about the Entomology Box!
• For more information about us & our podcast, head over to our website!
• Follow Just the Zoo of Us on BlueSky, Facebook, Instagram & Discord!
• Follow Ellen on Instagram or BlueSky!

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Ellen goes on a journey through time and space with Triops, the tadpole shrimp. We discuss book fairs, vernal pools, whether saltwater or freshwater came first, trips to space, prehistoric scampi, surprise guests at Burning Man, and so much more.

Sources:

1. "Ontogenetic sequence comparison of extant and fossil tadpole shrimps: no support for the “living fossil” concept" - Philipp Wagner et al., Paläontologische Zeitschrift, August 2017
2. “Survival of dormant organisms after long-term exposure to the space environment” - N. Novikova et al., Acta Astronautica, June 2010
3. “From antibiotics to yeast: Latest student science heads for space” - NASA, Science Daily, July 2014
4. “Hundreds of three-eyed 'dinosaur shrimp' emerge after Arizona monsoon” - Laura Geggel, LiveScience, October 2021
5. “What are the three-eyed ‘dinosaur shrimp’ resurfacing after Burning Man?” - Faiza Saqib, The Independent, September 2023
6. They Might Be Giants song “Triops Has Three Eyes”
7. “Adult Triops cancriformis (Pancrustacea: Notostraca) mediates the hatching rate of its resting eggs” - Alžbeta Devánová et al., Hydrobiologia, March 2022
8. “Tadpole Shrimp Are Coming for Your Rice” - PBS Deep Look

Links:

• For more information about us & our podcast, head over to our website!
• Follow Just the Zoo of Us on BlueSky, Facebook, Instagram & Discord!
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Join Ellen & special guest artist and reptile keeper Lyn for an up close and personal look at a little snake with a big appetite. We discuss how it feels to handle a snake, stress dreams specific to pet owners, gastoning it, spine teeth, snacktivities, how snakes flirt with each other, and so much more.

Links:

• Check out Lyn's art and comic on Instagram! 
• Denver folks, check out Lyn's upcoming snake shed jewelry & painting workshop!
• For more information about us & our podcast, head over to our website!
• Follow Just the Zoo of Us on BlueSky, Facebook, Instagram & Discord!
• Follow Ellen on Instagram or BlueSky!

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Ellen takes things slow with the iconic banana slug. We discuss mobile slip 'n' slides, recreationally poisoning yourself, liquid crystals, oobleck, robosnail, slime trains, moisture farming, apophallation, college mascots, and so much more.

Works Cited:

• "Banana Slugs: Secret of the Slime" for Mallory Pickett, KQED, February 2015
• "Mechanical Devices for Snail-like Locomotion" - Brian Chan et al., Journal of Intelligent Material Systems and Structures, February 2007
• "Tough adhesives for diverse wet surfaces" - J. Li et al., Science, July 2017
• "Emerging biotechnology promises to transform the materials we use to work and live" - L.G. Blanchard, University of Washington Magazine, September 1993
• "She studies slug sex by the seashore: UCSC researcher works to unlock secrets of banana slug sex" - Elise Overgaard, Lookout Santa Cruz, June 2023
• "Our Mascot: Sammy the Banana Slug", UC Santa Cruz (uscs.edu)

Links:

• For more information about us & our podcast, head over to our website!
• Follow Just the Zoo of Us on BlueSky, Facebook, Instagram & Discord!
• Follow Ellen on Instagram or BlueSky!

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Join Ellen & special guests, power couple Shannon Hackett and John Bates from the Field Museum, here to talk about the intersection of science, history, and of course, birds in a love letter to the natural history museum. We discuss working alongside SUE the T. rex, specimen pickles, harlequin romance novels, and explore bigger questions like how museum collections can reveal evolution happening around us right now in real-time and help us look into the future, what the average everyday person can learn about themselves and what science actually looks like from a museum, and the hotly contested debate as to whether grey vireos are interesting or not.

Links:

• Check out Birds of a Feather Talk Together on YouTube, Apple Podcasts, and Instagram!
• Learn more about the Field Museum on their website!
• For more information about us & our podcast, head over to our website!
• Follow Just the Zoo of Us on BlueSky, Facebook, Instagram & Discord!
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Ellen sets the record straight on Norway lemmings, busting over 400 years of myths. We discuss rodent audacity, ecological impacts that can be seen from space, spontaneous generation, Ole Worm, Atlantis, a Disney lie, and so much more.

Works Cited:

1. “Genome analyses suggest recent speciation and postglacial isolation in the Norwegian lemming” - Edana Lord et al., PNAS, June 2025
2. “Aposematism and crypsis in a rodent: antipredator defence of the Norwegian lemming” - Malte Andersson, Behavioral Ecology and Sociobiology, April 2015
3. "Vole and lemming activity observed from space" - Johan Olofsson et al, Nature Climate Change, May 2012
4. "Ole Worm (1588-1654) - anatomist and antiquarian" - Rafael Romero Reveron & Luis A Arráez-Aybar, European Journal of Anatomy, July 2015
5. "The Norwegian Lemming and its Migrations" - W. Duppa Crotch, Popular Science Monthly, August 1877
6. "Lemming Suicide Myth: Disney Film Faked Bogus Behavior" - Riley Woodford, Alaska Department of Fish & Game, September 2003
7. "Falling lemming populations" - Chris Smith, ScienceNorway.no, July 2012
8. "Lemmings’ loss is bounty for moss" - Bjørnar Kjensli, ScienceNorway.no, March 2012

Links:

• For more information about us & our podcast, head over to our website!
• Follow Just the Zoo of Us on BlueSky, Facebook, Instagram & Discord!
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Join Ellen & special guest comedian, writer, and nature enthusiast Vinny Thomas for a review of some of the furry, feathered, and scaly neighbors making themselves at home right in our very own cities. We discuss domestication, dogs with human feet, inflatable snoods, ostriches for self-defense, kaiju battles at the park, life in a shipwreck, and so much more.

Links:

• Follow Vinny on Instagram, Threads, and TikTok!
• For more information about us & our podcast, head over to our website!
• Follow Just the Zoo of Us on BlueSky, Facebook, Instagram & Discord!
• Follow Ellen on Instagram or BlueSky!

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Ellen gives the Tasmanian devil his due. We discuss mythbusters, cranial real estate, the masculine urge to bite your fingers off, which came first: the chicken or the egg, dump stats, contagious cancer, and so much more. 

Works Cited:

• "Too hot for the devil? Did climate change cause the mid-Holocene extinction of the Tasmanian devil Sarcophilus harrisii from mainland Australia?" - Shane D. Morris et al., Ecography, Dec 2021
• "Holocene Demographic Changes and the Emergence of Complex Societies in Prehistoric Australia" - Alan N. Williams et al., PLOS One, June 2015
• "Bite club: comparative bite force in big biting mammals and the prediction of predatory behaviour in fossil taxa" - Stephen Wroe, Colin McHenry & Jeffrey Thomason, Proc Biol Sci, March 2005
• "Saving our darling devils", Esme Mathis, Australian Geographic, January 2026

Links:

• For more information about us & our podcast, head over to our website!
• Follow Just the Zoo of Us on BlueSky, Facebook, Instagram & Discord!
• Follow Ellen on Instagram or BlueSky!

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Join Ellen & special guest, wildlife educator and zookeeper Jungle Jordan, as we round up his top 3 friend-shaped carnivores, all the cutest critters that could absolutely wreck you. We discuss hidden mickeys, toxic friend groups, modern-day sabertooths, delicious hair, an unlikely pair of woodland best friends, and so much more.

Links:

• Learn more about Jordan's work at his website: https://www.junglejordan.com/
• Follow him on Instagram, TikTok, YouTube, and Facebook!
• For more information about us & our podcast, head over to our website!
• Follow Just the Zoo of Us on BlueSky, Facebook, Instagram & Discord!
• Follow Ellen on Instagram or BlueSky!

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Ellen gets into the festive spirit with sea angels. We discuss Christian's beachfront disaster, secret tentacles, teeny titan battles, undismissable companions, Hello Kitty merch, and so much more.

Links:

• For more information about us & our podcast, head over to our website!
• Follow Just the Zoo of Us on BlueSky, Facebook, Instagram & Discord!
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Joined Ellen & special guest wildlife ambassador and care specialist Marco Wendt from the San Diego Zoo Safari Park for a review of the towering birds that are ready to literally rumble: cassowaries. We discuss short kings and feminine rage, a secret bird language humans can’t hear, nature’s best dads, getting a modern dinosaur to be brave for his shots, and so much more.

Links:

• Cassowary rumble audio: Marc Anderson, XC337534. Accessible at www.xeno-canto.org/337534.
• Learn more about the San Diego Zoo Wildlife Alliance and the San Diego Zoo Safari Park!
• Follow Marco on Instagram and TikTok!
• For more information about us & our podcast, head over to our website!
• Follow Just the Zoo of Us on BlueSky, Facebook, Instagram & Discord!
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Ellen irons out the kinkajous. We discuss Thomas Jefferson's giant moose sidequest, the dessert hypothesis, bad pets, who the real Frankenstein monster is,  and so much more.

Links:

• For more information about us & our podcast, head over to our website!
• Follow Just the Zoo of Us on BlueSky, Facebook, Instagram & Discord!
• Follow Ellen on BlueSky!

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Join Ellen & host of Bizarre Beasts Sarah Suta for a lineup of some animals she’d like to see get a second chance, whether they’re species we’ve already lost or ones that might still have a shot. We discuss foreign exchange student accents, the ecological impact of the invention of the telegraph, bird call sheet music, the scientific fumble of the century, bison where you least expect them, and so much more.

Links:

• Watch Bizarre Beasts and Endlings on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@BizarreBeasts
• Follow Bizarre Beasts on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/bizarrebeastsshow/
• Follow Sarah on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/sarah.suta/
• For more information about us & our podcast, head over to our website!
• Follow Just the Zoo of Us on BlueSky, Facebook, Instagram & Discord!
• Follow Ellen on BlueSky!

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In this week's re-broadcast of an episode from November of 2022, Ellen goes on an odyssey through history with the wild turkey. We discuss their path alongside humans for thousands of years, from prehistoric America to praise from Benjamin Franklin, the brink of extinction and nets fired out of cannons.  

Further viewing:

Rocket Netting Turkeys, a video demonstration by the LSU AgCenter 

Paul Kelly's Gobbling Demonstration

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Ellen has a bone to pick with turkey vultures. We discuss aura farming, our gripes with the pH scale, a check-in with our resident Dragon Ball Z correspodent, screaming inside your heart, laser harassment campaigns, and so much more.

Links:

• For more information about us & our podcast, head over to our website!
• Follow Just the Zoo of Us on BlueSky, Facebook, Instagram & Discord!
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Join Ellen & special guest from the world of wildlife rehabilitation Emma Ratway for a review of the chompy rogues lurking at the bottom of ponds all over the country: snapping turtles. We discuss working with wildlife and getting to raise and release baby snapping turtles, a jury of one’s deers, a cat named Crunch Wrap Supreme, butt breathing, magnets, simple English wikipedia, eating board game pieces, and so much more.

Links:

• Follow Emma on Instagram!
• For more information about us & our podcast, head over to our website!
• Follow Just the Zoo of Us on BlueSky, Facebook, Instagram & Discord!
• Follow Ellen on BlueSky!

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Ellen comes clean about the bluestreak cleaner wrasse. We discuss trust, cheating, fish patriarchy, manipulation, deception, game theory, the prisoner's dilemma, marketing, the mirror test, the horrors of self-awareness, and so much more. Christian drinks a Capri-Sun. 

Works Cited:

1. “Testing the Low-density Hypothesis for Reversed Sex Change in Polygynous Fish: Experiments in Labroides dimidiatus” - Tetsuo Kuwamura et al., Scientific Reports, March 2014
2. “Punishment and partner switching cause cooperative behavior in a cleaning mutualism” - Redouan Bshary & Alexandra Grutter, Biology Letters, July 2005
3. “Power and temptation cause shifts between exploitation and cooperation in a cleaner wrasse mutualism” - Simon Gingins et al., Proc. Biol. Sci., June 2013
4. “Male cleaner wrasses adjust punishment of female partners according to the stakes” by Nichola J Raihani et al., Proc. Biol. Sci., June 2011
5. “Cleaner fish are sensitive to what their partners can and cannot see” - Katherine McAuliffe et al., Communications Biology, Sep 2021
6. “Biting cleaner fish use altruism to deceive image-scoring client reef fish” by Redouan Bshary et al., Proc. Biol. Sci., Feb 2002
7. “If a fish can pass the mark test, what are the implications for consciousness and selfawareness testing in animals?” - Masanori Kohda et al., PLOS Biol, Feb 2019
8. “Further evidence for the capacity of mirror self-recognition in cleaner fish and the significance of ecologically relevant marks” - Masanori Kohda et al., PLOS Biol., Feb 2022
9. “Cleaner fish recognize self in a mirror via self-face recognition like humans” - Masanori Kohda et al., Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences, Feb 2023
10. “Cleaner fish with mirror self-recognition capacity precisely realize their body size based on their mental image” - Taiga Kobayashi et al., Scientific Reports, Sep 2024
11. “The false cleanerfish relies on aggressive mimicry to bite fish fins when benthic foods are scarce in their local habitat” - Misaki Fujisawa et al., Scientific Reports, May 2020

Links:

• For more information about us & our podcast, head over to our website!
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Join Ellen & special guest, zoology and science communication powerhouse Lindsay Nikole, for a review of some of the animal kingdom’s greatest hits throughout the history of the Earth. We discuss ecological gossip, mass extinctions, the Cambrian explosion and evolution’s “experimental” phase, swimming potatoes with googly eyes, giant bugs, bizarre prehistoric sharks, imaginary friend lore, and so much more.

Links:

• Pre-order your copy of Lindsay's book, Epic Earth!
• Follow Lindsay on Instagram, YouTube, and TikTok!
• For more information about us & our podcast, head over to our website!
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Ellen gets her claws out for the hairy frog. We discuss what the tooth fairy dispatch system is doing with all those teeth, frog gigging, Wolverine lore, the scariest horror of all: Chytridiomycosis, and so much more.

Links:

• For more information about us & our podcast, head over to our website!
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Join Ellen & special guest, writer and science journalist Cara Giaimo, for a highlight reel of some of the animal kingdom’s biggest surprises. We discuss Lego trebuchets, the scifi potential of a projectile-based language, endangered relationships, biofluorescence, the great pacific garbage patch’s number 1 fan, and so much more. 

Links:

• Find Atlas Obscura: Wild Life and Leaving the Ocean Was a Mistake where books are sold!
• Follow Cara on BlueSky!
• Get updates from Cara's newsletter, What's New in Animals & Plants!
• Find more of Cara's work on her website: https://caragiaimo.com/
• For more information about us & our podcast, head over to our website!
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Ellen jumps to conclusions about jack jumper ants. We discuss Metazooa, is it cake, a menace to public health, lime in the Coke, gamergate, casual abductions, learning walks, and so much more. 

Links:

• Play Metazooa: https://metazooa.com/
• For more information about us & our podcast, head over to our website!
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Join Ellen & special guest artist and science communicator behind Nature Disturbed for an appropriate kickoff to the month of all things wretched with a review of disgust. We talk about phobias and ways that we can relate and empathize with even our most feared animals, why we might want to move in to a termite colony, anatomical surprises, the uncanny valley, how to make a slime meringue, and so much more. 

Links:

• Learn more about Nature Disturbed at naturedisturbed.com
• Follow Nature Disturbed on Instagram and check out the podcast!
• For more information about us & our podcast, head over to our website!
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Ellen comes along for the ride with Galápagos tortoises. We discuss how giant tortoises crossed 600 miles of ocean, the superpowers built into their DNA that let them live for over a century, extinction and restoration, Charles Darwin's boat snacks, Kung Fu Panda lore, and so much more.

Links:

• Follow Poison Oak and find more of her work on Instagram: @poison.oak.nyc
• For more information about us & our podcast, head over to our website!
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Join Ellen & special guest, primatologist and author Dr. Keriann McGoogan, for primatology storytime! Our guest shares experiences from her time working with lemurs in Madagascar and howler monkeys in Belize, like kind gestures from people helping out their local monkeys after a hurricane. She also brings us some truly juicy tales from the study of primates, like a true crime thriller involving missing monkeys, a power struggle, and even a double life, an airplane full of macaques, setting the record straight on baboon social heirarchies, and the instrumental role of women in shaping primatology and our understanding of nature.

Links:

• Learn more about Dr. Keriann McGoogan's work on her website
• Get your copy of Sisters of the Jungle: The Trailblazing Women Who Shaped the Study of Wild Primates
• Follow Keriann on Instagram!
• For more information about us & our podcast, head over to our website!
• Follow Just the Zoo of Us on BlueSky, Facebook, Instagram & Discord!
• Follow Ellen on BlueSky!

Sound Credit:

Black howler monkey: Alex Munro, via biacoustica: https://bio.acousti.ca/content/black-howler-monkey-short

Siamang: Frank Lambert, XC1031364. Accessible at www.xeno-canto.org/1031364.

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Join Ellen & birder and science communicator Jason Hall for a review of a little bird full of big surprises: the American dipper.  We discuss birding pre-smartphone, Philadelphia’s role in ornithological history, the wild physiological adaptations that let this tiny songbird brave mountain rapids, smooth dance moves, aura farming, and so much more.

Links:

• Follow Jason on Instagram: @thebirdingbeardsman
• Check out Jason's podcast, The Bird Joy Podcast!
• Get involved in nature with In Color Birding!
• For more information about us & our podcast, head over to our website!
• Follow Just the Zoo of Us on BlueSky, Facebook, Instagram & Discord!
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Sound credits:

• Brown-headed cowbird: Thomas Magarian, XC527674. Accessible at www.xeno-canto.org/527674.
• American dipper: Ted Floyd, XC460525. Accessible at www.xeno-canto.org/460525.
• Swainson's thrush: Stanislas Wroza, XC1014351. Accessible at www.xeno-canto.org/1014351.

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Ellen demystifies the deep sea-dwelling bigfin squid. We discuss hunting for shipwrecks, life in the trenches, spaghetti noodle fingers, unintentional cinematography, and so much more. 

Links:

• For more information about us & our podcast, head over to our website!
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Sound Credit:

Ted Floyd, XC460525. Accessible at www.xeno-canto.org/460525.

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Join Ellen & special guest, wildlife veterinarian, filmmaker and science communicator Dr César Puechmarin, for a review of Australia’s masters of song: the lyrebird.  We discuss birdwatching drama, the ancient origins of songbirds, vocal anatomy, secret passwords, oral history and cultural memory passed down through generations and the ghosts remembered in birdsong, and so much more.

Links:

• Learn more about César and find more of his work on his website!
• Check out César's podcasts: Death By Birding & Every Animal Ever!
• Pre-order César's book, Nature People!
• Follow César on Instagram!
• For more information about us & our podcast, head over to our website!
• Follow Just the Zoo of Us on BlueSky, Facebook, Instagram & Discord!
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Sound Credit:

• Superb lyrebird (Menura novaehollandiae) call: Greg McLachlan, XC368459. Accessible at www.xeno-canto.org/368459.

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Ellen & Christian team up as a coyote and badger in a cozy duet TTRPG adventure. When a family of skunks accuse a reclusive bobcat of disturbing their peaceful home, the woodland's finest pair of peacekeepers are on the case. We use the Badger + Coyote game system by Pandion Games to improvise a collaborative story of mystery, fire, a waterfall cave, legend of stalking predators in the night, devious traps, and even romance.

Links:

• Check out Badger + Coyote, the cozy duet TTRPG of mischief and survival from Pandion Games!
• Check out more of the games and resources from Pandion Games!
• For more information about us & our podcast, head over to our website!
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Ellen gives the mysterious wing-clapping nightjars a round of applause. We discuss Pliny the Elder, bird whiskers, what it really means to "raise one's standards," ecologically accurate sound effects in The Legend of Zelda, an acoustic mystery, El Chupacabra, and so much more. 

Links:

• For more information about us & our podcast, head over to our website!
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• SOUND CREDITS: 
• Eastern Whip-poor-will call: Jonathon Jongsma, via Wikimedia Commons - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Antrostomus_vociferus_-_Eastern_Whip-poor-will_-_XC103418.ogg
• Chuck-wills-widow call: Wikimedia Commons user Jordgette - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Chuck-wills-widow_call_01.ogg
• Nightjar wing clapping: Chris Packham and Wild Finca, via Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=1125878613362748

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Join Ellen & returning guest, science communicator and comedy writer Katie Goldin, for a roundup of her 3 weirdest facts about sharks. We discuss cage-free uranium, possible mermaid configurations, why sometimes people poop themselves when they’re scared, how fomo can conquer phobia, eye teeth, and so much more. 

Heads up: part of this episode’s conversation is about cocaine. When it comes up I will have edited in some guidance for skipping ahead for anyone who might not find that suitable. As always, there’s no profanity or anything graphic, but it is a topic of discussion.

Links:

• Listen to Katie's podcast, Secretly Incredibly Fascinating!
• Listen to Katie's other podcast, Creature Feature!
• Follow Katie on BlueSky!
• For more information about us & our podcast, head over to our website!
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In this week's re-broadcast of an episode from September of 2022, Ellen lets Pallas's cat out of the bag & Christian probes into the world of the sensitive kiwi. We discuss grumpy cats, spawncamping, chilly beans, buff legs and giant eggs.

Links:

• Check out Benjamin Lancer's paper on dragonfly attention in Nature!
• Watch Wildlife Instincts: Pallas's Cat - Master of the Plains on YouTube!
• Learn more about how you can help the kiwi!
• For more information about us & our podcast, head over to our website!
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Ellen explains what the red fox REALLY says. We discuss a chicken shakedown, the Siberian fox domestication experiment, aim assist, quantum entanglement, genetic surprises, and so much more. 

Links:

• For more information about us & our podcast, head over to our website!
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• SOUND CREDIT: Fox screaming in the night.mp3 by craigsays -- https://freesound.org/s/537586/ -- License: Creative Commons 0

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Join Ellen & special guest, marine biologist and seabird wrangler Melina Watson, for a review of the ocean’s bravest little walkerwalkers: Leach’s storm petrel. We swap whalewatching stories, discuss snot gutters and lost feet and baby chicks that look like soot sprites, and get firsthand insight into life among the seabirds, from falling asleep to a lullaby of screams to a surprising assessment of the smell situation.

Links:

• Follow Melina on Instagram!
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Ellen pokes her nose into the giant anteater's business. We discuss Fun Dip, sleeper builds, optical illusions, blankies, the shirshu, and so much more.

Links:

• Learn more about the ICAS on their website and follow them on Instagram!
• For more information about us & our podcast, head over to our website!
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Join Ellen & special guest, digital artist and character designer Roxy Valdez, for a multimedia exploration of the intersection where real-world biology and ecology meets the imagination: speculative evolution! We discuss the world of the Amphiterra Project, the academic research and creative process that goes into designing creatures for science fiction and fantasy, and even team up to roll dice and make our very own creatures. Our guest provides illustrations and an interactive spec evo prompt generator that will be posted on our socials to accompany this episode!

Links:

• Follow Roxy on BlueSky: https://bsky.app/profile/bighugefrog.bsky.social
• Find more of Roxy's work and info: https://bighugefrog.carrd.co/
• Find the Amphiterra Project: https://amphiterra.weebly.com/
• Roxy's Recommendations:
• Serina: https://sites.google.com/site/worldofserina/home
• Runaway to the Stars: https://www.runawaytothestars.com/
• The Snouters: Form and Life of the Rhinogrades: https://archive.org/details/snoutersforml00stum
• Dougal Dixon: https://www.dougal-dixon.co.uk/
• Curious Archive: https://www.youtube.com/@CuriousArchive
• For more information about us & our podcast, head over to our website!
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Christian takes charge of rhinoceroses & Ellen gives bird-eating tarantulas a hair-raising review. We discuss unicorns, mmwonk, dragon calls, Ace Ventura, becoming the Thumbtacks Guy, recipes for a bag of spiders, and more. 

Links:

• For more information about us & our podcast, head over to our website!
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Join Ellen and acclaimed naturalist Ivan Phillipsen to round up his top 3 weirdest birds. We discuss what makes a bird truly “weird,” the distinct silhouette of a style icon, never letting a perfectly good placenta go to waste, birds getting tipsy on fermented berries, and so much more.

Links:

• Find more of Ivan's work at scienceofbirds.com!
• Go check out Ivan's podcast, The Science of Birds!
• For more information about us & our podcast, head over to our website!
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• Source of audio clip played at 42 minutes 17 seconds: Jacob Wijpkema, XC695095. Accessible at www.xeno-canto.org/695095.

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Ellen & special guest Isaac answer questions from young listeners! We discuss albinism, whales and dinosaurs, what makes an organism an animal, raccoon stripes, the puppification of foxes, and so much more.

Links:

• For more information about us & our podcast, head over to our website!
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