Lenny's Podcast: Product | Career | Growth

If you ever wanted to distill 3,310 hours of knowledge into 60 minutes, then this episode is for you. For the last 6 months, Lenny’s Podcast has been downloaded more than 2 million times and is now a top 10 technology podcast across both Apple and Spotify. And in this special episode, I’m breaking down the top 10 most downloaded episodes, plus sharing my favorite lessons from each. It's unlike anything I've done before, and I hope you love it. Happy holidays, happy new year, and from the bottom of my heart, thank you so much for listening, sharing, and for supporting the podcast. I’ll see you in 2023!

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Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for supporting this podcast:

• TED—ReThinking with Adam Grant: https://adamgrant.net/podcasts/rethinking/

• Notion—One workspace. Every team: https://www.notion.com/lennyspod

• Vanta—Automate compliance. Simplify security: https://vanta.com/lenny

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Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

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The 10 most downloaded episodes of 2022:

* April Dunford on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/april-dunford-on-product-positioning-segmentation-and-optimizing-your-sales-process/

* Crystal Widjaja on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/how-to-scrappily-hire-for-measure-and-unlock-growth-crystal-widjaja-gojek-and-kumu/

* Julie Zhuo on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/julie-zhuo-on-accelerating-your-career-impostor-syndrome-writing-building-product-sense-using-intuition-vs-data-hiring-designers-and-moving-into-management/

* Shishir Mehrotra on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/the-rituals-of-great-teams-shishir-mehrotra-coda-youtube-microsoft/

* Kristen Berman on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/using-behavioral-science-to-improve-your-product-kristen-berman-irrational-labs/

* Elena Verna on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/elena-verna-on-how-b2b-growth-is-changing-product-led-growth-product-led-sales-why-you-should-go-freemium-not-trial-what-features-to-make-free-and-much-more/

* Ethan Smith on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/the-ultimate-guide-to-seo-ethan-smith-graphite/

* Shreyas Doshi on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/shreyas-doshi-on-pre-mortems-the-lno-framework-the-three-levels-of-product-work-why-most-execution-problems-are-strategy-problems-and-roi-vs-opportunity-cost-thinking/

* Marty Cagan on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/the-nature-of-product-marty-cagan-silicon-valley-product-group/

* Matt Mochary on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/how-to-fire-people-with-grace-work-through-fear-and-nurture-innovation-matt-mochary-ceo-coach/

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In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) About this episode

(02:46) April Dunford on positioning your product

(07:16) Crystal Widjaja on why most analytics efforts fail

(11:42) Julie Zhuo on overcoming imposter syndrome

(19:14) Shishir Mehrotra’s favorite interview question

(23:27) Shishir Mehrotra’s PSHE career growth framework

(27:10) Kristen Berman on using behavioral science to improve your product

(33:29) Elena Verna on why retention is so important

(36:31) Elena Verna on what to put into your freemium product

(37:57) Ethan Smith on how people often under-resource SEO

(38:46) Ethan Smith on when it’s time to invest in SEO

(42:41) Shreyas Doshi’s LNO Framework

(50:12) Marty Cagan on why big companies are often bad at product

(51:46) Marty Cagan’s four steps to being a good product manager

(53:48) Matt Mochary on the power of small teams

(57:17) Matt Mochary’s advice for making hard conversations easier

(59:05) Other episodes that left a lasting impact

(59:40) Thank you for joining me (Lenny) on this incredible journey

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Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Chris Hutchins recently left his position as Head of New Product Strategy at Wealthfront to focus full-time on his podcast, All the Hacks. If you’re thinking about starting your own podcast or are simply interested in the process, be sure to check out today’s episode. We dive deep on all things podcasting: the pros and cons, how to climb the charts, and how much time you should expect to spend on each episode from start to finish. We talk in-depth about the process, from pre-production to publication, and share all of the products we use for recording, editing, and publishing. Chris also offers some important tips and tricks on how to get your first subscribers and how to market and grow your podcast, as well as some incredible money-saving hacks that you can start implementing today.

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Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/launching-and-growing-a-podcast-chris

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Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for supporting this podcast:

• Notion—One workspace. Every team: https://www.notion.com/lennyspod

• Vanta—Automate compliance. Simplify security: https://vanta.com/lenny

• Lenny’s Job Board—Hire the best product people. Find the best product gigs: https://www.lennysjobs.com/talent

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Where to find Chris Hutchins:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/hutchins

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/chrishutchins/

• Website: https://chrishutchins.com/

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Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

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Referenced:

• All the Hacks podcast: https://www.allthehacks.com/

• All the Hacks newsletter: https://allthehacks.com/email

• Andy Rachleff on Twitter: https://twitter.com/arachleff

• Kerri Walsh Jennings on All the Hacks: https://www.allthehacks.com/performance-psychology-kerri-walsh-jennings/

• Descript: https://www.descript.com/

• Erika Taught Me podcast: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/erika-taught-me/id1650076906

• Leigh Rowan on All the Hacks: https://www.allthehacks.com/travel-hacks-leigh-rowan/

• Kevin Kelly’s “1,000 True Fans”: https://kk.org/thetechnium/1000-true-fans/

• Emily Oster’s books: https://emilyoster.net/writing/

• Chris Hutchins on The Kevin Rose Show: https://podcast.kevinrose.com/guests/chris-hutchins/

• Nick Gray’s newsletter: https://nickgray.net/signup-for-email-updates/

• The 2-Hour Cocktail Party: How to Build Big Relationships with Small Gatherings: https://www.amazon.com/2-Hour-Cocktail-Party-Relationships-Gatherings-ebook/dp/B0B2KW6T7J

• MrBeast on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCX6OQ3DkcsbYNE6H8uQQuVA

• Gary Vaynerchuk on Twitter: https://twitter.com/garyvee

• The Danny Miranda Podcast: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-danny-miranda-podcast/id1532160275

• Ray Dalio on Twitter: https://twitter.com/RayDalio

• Danny Miranda’s newsletter on Substack: https://dannymiranda.substack.com/

• ATRX2100 mic bundle on Amazon: https://www.amazon.com/Audio-Technica-ATR2100X-USB-Microphone-Bundle-Filter/dp/B082SYHRY9/r

• Riverside: https://riverside.fm/

• Focusrite Scarlett 2i2 on Amazon: https://www.amazon.com/Focusrite-Scarlett-Audio-Interface-Tools/dp/B07QR73T66

• Sony Alpha 7C mirrorless full-frame camera on Amazon: https://www.amazon.com/Sony-Alpha-Full-Frame-Mirrorless-Camera/dp/B08HVZLQ4F

• Adobe Audition: https://www.adobe.com/products/audition.html

• Pro Tools: https://www.avid.com/pro-tools

• Podpage: https://www.podpage.com/

• Simplecast: https://www.simplecast.com/

• Chartable: https://chartable.com/

• Podstatus: https://podstatus.com/

• Overcast: https://overcast.fm/

• Happy Money: https://www.amazon.com/Happy-Money-Ken-Honda-audiobook/dp/B07MJHJ57T/

• Vagabonding: An Uncommon Guide to the Art of Long-Term World Travel: https://www.amazon.com/Vagabonding-Uncommon-Guide-Long-Term-Travel/dp/0812992180

• Die with Zero: https://www.amazon.com/Die-Zero-Getting-Your-Money/dp/0358099765

• Animal Spirits Podcast: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/animal-spirits-podcast/id1310192007

• Mythic Quest on AppleTV+: https://tv.apple.com/us/show/mythic-quest

• Unclaimed money: https://www.usa.gov/unclaimed-money

• Savendeals.com: https://www.savendeals.com/

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In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Chris’s background

(03:25) Lesson’s from Wealthfront

(09:25) Why storytelling and communication are every bit as important as the product

(11:04) Why you need to understand the user’s experience and keep up with what others are building

(14:56) Why you should focus on overall impact, not just doing what your boss wants

(17:39) Why Chris likes working on big, crazy ideas

(19:10) The early days of Chris’s All the Hacks podcast

(21:34) The pros and cons of starting a podcast

(24:19) The time required to produce an episode

(27:09) How Lenny started his podcast 

(28:29) Launch lessons and how Apple rankings work

(30:49) Why you need to create authentic content

(32:57) Be one person’s favorite podcast

(35:01) How Chris ideated and titled All the Hacks

(40:09) How to get started and get your first subscribers

(43:52) How Gary Vaynerchuk used Twitter to establish authority 

(45:07) How to take advantage of platforms with built-in growth engines

(47:42) The power of in-person interviews

(48:57) How to pitch to other podcasts

(51:27) Equipment and products for producing podcasts

(57:36) How many downloads it takes in order to be taken seriously

(1:01:28) Using Overcast as a growth lever

(1:09:02) Lightning round

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Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Pete Kazanjy is the author of Founding Sales: The Early Stage Go-to-Market Handbook and the founder of Modern Sales Pros, an invite-only peer learning community focused on sales operations and sales leadership. He’s also the co-founder of Atrium, a B2B SaaS company that provides data-driven sales solutions. Pete got his start in product at VMware and then dove deep into the art and science of sales. In today’s episode, we talk about the importance of founder-led sales and how to methodically scale a sales department. He explains the difference between old-school sales and modern sales, which focuses on human connection and solving problems for customers. He also shares actionable tips to improve your sales technique and explains how to use data to monitor your success at different milestones in the sales process.

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Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/founder-led-sales-pete-kazanjy-founding

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Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for supporting this podcast:

• Vanta—Automate compliance. Simplify security: https://vanta.com/lenny

• Flatfile—A CSV importer that says yes instead of error: mismatch: https://www.flatfile.com/lenny

• Merge—A single API to add hundreds of integrations into your app: http://merge.dev/lenny

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Where to find Pete:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/Kazanjy

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kazanjy/

• Website: https://kazanjy.svbtle.com/

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Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

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Referenced:

• Founding Sales: The Early Stage Go-to-Market Handbook: https://www.amazon.com/Founding-Sales-Go-Market-Handbook-ebook/dp/B08PMK17Z1

• Brianne Kimmel’s SaaS school: http://briannekimmel.com/saas-school/

• Modern Sales Pros: https://modernsaleshq.com/

• The Lean Startup: How Today’s Entrepreneurs Use Continuous Innovation to Create Radically Successful Businesses: https://www.amazon.com/Lean-Startup-Entrepreneurs-Continuous-Innovation/dp/0307887898

• The Four Steps to the Epiphany: Successful Strategies for Products That Win: https://www.amazon.com/Four-Steps-Epiphany-Successful-Strategies/dp/1119690358/

• Pete’s presentation on founder-led sales: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WAXIVAZJyPA

• Pete’s guest post on Lenny’s newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/sales-bottom-up

• The Cadence: How to Operate a SaaS Startup: https://medium.com/craft-ventures/the-cadence-how-to-operate-a-saas-startup-436aa8099e8

• Maker vs. Manager Schedule: http://www.paulgraham.com/makersschedule.html

• Amplitude: https://amplitude.com/

• Atrium: https://www.atriumhq.com/

• Greenhouse: https://www.greenhouse.io/

• Pete’s ICP Template: https://www.foundingsales.com/2-product-marketing#building-narrative

• Marissa Fuhrer Bell on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/marissafuhrer/

• Data-driven sales master class: https://salesnerds.atriumhq.com/msp-nailing-science-of-sales-figma-webinar-video

• The Goal: A Process of Ongoing Improvement: https://www.amazon.com/Goal-Process-Ongoing-Improvement/dp/0884271951

• The Score Takes Care of Itself: My Philosophy of Leadership: https://www.amazon.com/Score-Takes-Care-Itself-Philosophy/dp/1591843472

• All-In podcast: https://www.allinpodcast.co/

• Encanto on Disney+: https://www.disneyplus.com/movies/encanto/33q7DY1rtHQH

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In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) How Pete met Lenny 

(05:05) Pete’s background

(07:20) Modern sales vs. old-school sales

(09:17) What is founder-led sales, and why is it so important?

(14:58) When to hire your first salesperson 

(18:20) Why you should keep your in-person events to around 10 people

(19:34) What a sales motion is and why it needs to be updated regularly 

(20:55) What are the leading indicators of success?

(23:54) Why founders don’t need to be rock stars at sales

(28:28) Sales mindset changes—the number-one tip to improve your sales

(33:30) How modern sales should focus on helping customers solve problems

(36:00) A few tips to help you get better at sales

(36:40) ICP and personas

(39:14) Why you should hire junior sales staff in the early stages

(45:40) Signs your new hires aren’t a good fit

(47:38) The importance of using metrics for success

(49:33) Month-by-month expectations for sales hires

(51:19) Why work from home is bad for junior salespeople

(54:19) Why you shouldn’t be afraid of sales

(55:19) Lightning round

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Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Camille Ricketts began her career in journalism, at the Wall Street Journal, in 2006. In 2010 she joined Tesla, where she worked in communications alongside Elon Musk. She transitioned into marketing and became the Head of Content and Marketing at First Round Capital and then went on to become the very first marketing hire at Notion. In today’s episode, we dig into community-led growth—what it is, and when and how to pursue it. We get super-specific on how Notion championed their most loyal users and built a passionate community, and the incredible outcome it had for the company’s growth. We also talk about how to create great content, and how content can drive growth for your business and brand.

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Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/how-notion-leveraged-community-to

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Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for supporting this podcast:

• Eppo—Run reliable, impactful experiments: https://www.geteppo.com/

• Flatfile—A CSV importer that says yes instead of error: mismatch: https://www.flatfile.com/lenny

• Vanta—Automate compliance. Simplify security: https://vanta.com/lenny

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Where to find Camille:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/camillericketts

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/camillericketts/

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Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

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People referenced:

• Ivan Zhao: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ivanhzhao/

• Simon Last: https://www.linkedin.com/in/simon-last-41404140/

• Lexie Barnhorn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/alexisbarnhorn/

• Ben Lang: https://www.linkedin.com/in/benmlang/

• Claire Butler: https://www.linkedin.com/in/clairetbutler/

• Jessi Craige Shikman at First Round: https://firstround.com/person/jessi-craige-shikman/

• Brett Berson at First Round: https://firstround.com/person/brett-berson/

• Josh Kopelman at First Round: https://firstround.com/person/josh-kopelman/#mystory

• Shaun Young on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/shaunyou/

• David Pierce at The Verge: https://www.theverge.com/authors/david-pierce

• Francisco Cruz-Mendoza: https://www.linkedin.com/in/franciscocrz/

• Emma Yee Yick: https://www.linkedin.com/in/emmayeeyick/ 

Additionally, Camille would love to shout out Nate Martins and Andrea Lim, who ran Notion’s content program:

• Nate Martins: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nate-martins/

• Andrea Lim: https://www.linkedin.com/in/andreawlim/

Content and companies referenced:

• Community & Content Resources: https://camnotes.notion.site/Community-Content-Resources-f18fb1db2d094ec2a4140a7737fae362

• Station F: https://stationf.co/

• Figma: https://www.figma.com/

• Canva: https://www.canva.com/

• Stripe: https://stripe.com/

• Stripe Atlas: https://stripe.com/atlas

• Salesforce: https://www.salesforce.com/

• First Round Review: https://review.firstround.com/

• Jobs to be done framework: https://jobs-to-be-done.com/jobs-to-be-done-a-framework-for-customer-needs-c883cbf61c90

• The Only App You Need for Work-Life Productivity: https://www.wsj.com/articles/the-only-app-you-need-for-work-life-productivity-1521640800

• Product Hunt: https://www.producthunt.com/

Referenced in lightning round:

• Obviously Awesome: How to Nail Product Positioning So Customers Get It, Buy It, Love It: https://www.amazon.com/Obviously-Awesome-Product-Positioning-Customers/dp/1999023005

• April Dunford on Lenny’s podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/april-dunford-on-product-positioning-segmentation-and-optimizing-your-sales-process/

• April Dunford’s guest post in Lenny’s newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/positioning

• Harry Stebbings’s podcast, 20VC: https://www.thetwentyminutevc.com/podcast/

• Lenny on 20VC: https://www.thetwentyminutevc.com/lenny-rachitsky/

• Tár: https://www.imdb.com/title/tt14444726/

• Fleishman Is in Trouble: https://www.hulu.com/series/fleishman-is-in-trouble-710e51f8-3387-404d-8b07-e7c9b766d11c

• Notion: https://www.notion.so/

• Arc: https://arc.net/

• Superhuman: https://superhuman.com/

• Cron: https://cron.com/

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In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Camille’s background

(05:43) What it was like working with Elon Musk

(07:38) Working at Notion in the early days

(12:16) What is community-led growth?

(15:48) How Notion measured the impact of marketing efforts

(16:35) The most successful community efforts at Notion

(18:24) Why metrics aren’t always necessary for community growth 

(19:52) When it makes sense to invest in community-led growth

(21:34) How creators make money using Notion

(23:12) The Ambassador Program and Champions Program at Notion

(27:20) Why founders should consider investing in community and delay monetizing some features

(31:03) Companies that have done well in building community

(32:54) How to determine the level of community engagement appropriate for your company to invest in

(34:00) Using Camille’s 2x2 grid to implement community

(36:42) How to launch an ambassador program

(41:22) Advice for founders who want to build community

(47:17) How Lenny got his first 500 newsletter subscribers

(48:58) Examples of Camille’s most impactful content marketing

(51:20) Content-market fit: how to determine the needs of your reader 

(53:37) Content categories and the time it takes to create top-notch content

(57:02) The future of comms and how the press helped Notion grow

(1:01:35) Lightning round

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Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Madhavan Ramanujam is a senior partner at Simon-Kucher, where he works with tier-one tech companies like Uber, Asana, and LinkedIn to help them develop their pricing and monetization strategies. He’s also the author of the most widely read book on pricing strategy, Monetizing Innovation. In today’s podcast, we talk about all the elements that go into your pricing strategy. Madhavan gives real-life examples of having conversations about “willingness to pay,” how segmentation should impact your pricing, and when to start thinking about pricing. He also shares tips on how behavioral pricing impacts your thinking, how to restructure your pricing during a downturn, and much more.

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Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/the-art-and-science-of-pricing-madhavan

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Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Lemon.io—a marketplace of vetted software developers. Get your match within 48h: https://lemon.io/lenny

• Mixpanel—product analytics that everyone can trust, use, and afford: https://mixpanel.com/startups

• Miro—a collaborative visual platform where your best work comes to life: https://miro.com/lenny

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Where to find Madhavan Ramanujam:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/madhavansf

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/madhavan-ramanujam-1533063/

• Website: https://www.simon-kucher.com/en-us/leadership

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Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

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Referenced:

• Monetizing Innovation: https://www.amazon.com/Monetizing-Innovation-Companies-Design-Product/dp/1119240867

• It’s Price Before Product. Period: https://review.firstround.com/its-price-before-product-period

• Rahul Vohra on NFX podcast: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JCiMqVC6Dok

• Leaders, Killers, and Fillers framework: https://kevinacohn.medium.com/leaders-fillers-and-killers-creating-bundles-that-work-7f4c7329cf53

• Predictably Irrational: https://www.amazon.com/Predictably-Irrational-Revised-Expanded-Decisions/dp/0061353248

• Preorder Unlocking Growth: https://www.amazon.com/Maximize-Profits-Prices-Products-Services/dp/1119633060

• Confessions of the Pricing Man: https://www.amazon.com/Confessions-Pricing-Man-Affects-Everything/dp/B08TZPRKVY

• Simon-Kucher books: https://www.simon-kucher.com/en-us/resources/books

• Mastering SaaS pricing (Kyle Poyar): https://www.saas-knowledge-base.com/docs/mastering-saas-pricing-from-mvp-to-ipo

• 6 Must-Reads on Pricing a Product: https://review.firstround.com/our-6-must-reads-on-pricing-a-product

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In this episode, we cover:

(03:24) Madhavan’s background

(06:29) How Madhavan got into pricing and monetization

(08:02 ) Why he wrote Monetizing Innovation

(09:43) Why pricing is a cross-functional discipline, but ultimately a function of product

(11:27) What “willingness to pay” is, and why founders need to have conversations about it early and often

(15:23) How Porsche built their SUV around customer feedback and willingness to pay

(18:46) How testing helped a marketplace company avoid building something customers don’t value

(23:50) Several methods to use to learn willingness to pay

(33:38) When and how the willingness-to-pay conversations happen

(37:08) How many customers you should be talking to

(38:13) When to revisit pricing

(39:20) Segmentation strategies

(42:42) Why you need to act differently to your segments that have different needs

(44:33) When to think about segmentation

(47:49) Examples of segmentation done well

(52:24) The importance of dynamic segmentation

(53:19) The three pricing strategies: maximizing, penetrating, and skimming

(55:49) How to use bundling and packaging to unlock segmentation

(59:50) Why how you charge is more important than how much

(1:03:30) Subscription vs. usage 

(1:07:40) Pricing options and structures

(1:10:22) How to run tests to see which pricing model works best

(1:12:06) Focusing on benefits vs. features

(1:16:13) What behavioral pricing is and why it’s important

(1:20:54) Tactics for behavioral pricing

(1:26:33) Determining pricing thresholds 

(1:28:23) Tips for pricing in a depressed market

(1:32:50) Madhavan’s new book

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Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Sahil Mansuri is the CEO of Bravado, the world’s largest online sales community. Sahil is passionate about sales, and his experience dates all the way back to 2008, working for Obama’s presidential campaign. During his time at Glassdoor, Sahil was able to close some incredible accounts, including Facebook, Google, Microsoft, and Amazon. In today’s podcast, we talk about why sales is a crucial part of any business and how to continue selling successfully through a recession. We get super-specific on building a conservative plan for the near future and cover everything from where to place your best salespeople to restructuring comp plans. The episode is full of great advice about how to shift with this market, improve agility, and perhaps grow an even stronger business with happier customers. 

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Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/how-to-hit-revenue-targets-in-a-recession-sahil-mansuri-bravado/#transcript

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Where to find Sahil Mansuri:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/svmansuri

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/sahilmansuri/

• Email: sahil@bravado.co

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Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Flatfile: https://www.flatfile.com/lenny

• Merge: http://merge.dev/lenny

• Miro: https://miro.com/lenny

—

Referenced:

• Bravado: https://bravado.co/

• Stumbling on Happiness: https://www.amazon.com/Stumbling-Happiness-Daniel-Gilbert/dp/1400077427

• All-In podcast: https://www.allinpodcast.co/

• How I Built This podcast: https://www.npr.org/series/490248027/how-i-built-this

• The Blacklist on Netflix: https://www.netflix.com/title/70281312

• The Newsroom on Hulu: https://www.hulu.com/series/the-newsroom-3d51e070-e77d-4294-ac83-cab80d3f94dd

• The West Wing on HBO Max: https://www.hbomax.com/series/urn:hbo:series:GX5nwgQDNJZ6aoQEAAAHJ

• Jeopardy!: https://www.jeopardy.com/watch

• Frasier on Hulu: https://www.hulu.com/series/frasier-0cb9b63b-de82-4751-99c9-1cb12118ab9d

• Slack: https://slack.com/

• Zoom: https://zoom.us/

• Grain: https://grain.com/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(04:19) Sahil’s background

(08:26) What is Bravado? 

(10:27) How to shift your sales strategy to meet the market

(12:00) How to set a conservative plan that still allows you to lean in when growth is possible

(19:06) Why the downturn in tech may not be over anytime soon

(21:34) How Bravado gets its data from users and creates global benchmarks 

(23:04) Why SAAS has an outdated comp structure

(33:23) Why companies are resistant to restructuring comp plans

(37:18) The problem with hypergrowth in today’s market

(41:18) Why it’s time to shift into a retention-based strategy

(43:28) Why your best sales staff should transition to post-sales for customer retention

(51:20) What are warm intros, and how can existing customers help you get new ones?

(59:30) How Sahil was able to get Facebook’s account at Glassdoor

(1:08:08) Why CEOs are actually salespeople

(1:12:50) How to survive a downturn

(1:19:44) Lightning round

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Ethan Smith is the CEO of Graphite, a boutique growth agency that’s helped companies like MasterClass, Thumbtack, Robinhood, Medium, and Honey develop and execute their SEO strategies. SEO is one of the least-understood levers for growth, while also one with the biggest payoff. This episode is a true master class on all things SEO. Ethan shares a wealth of information, including when you should begin investing in SEO, how to build an SEO team, and the three main buckets of SEO. He explains the difference between topics and keywords, gives the exact heuristics and tools to help you be successful in developing and implementing your own SEO strategy, and also goes deep on how to deal with roadblocks and advocate for resources.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/the-ultimate-guide-to-seo-ethan-smith

—

Where to find Ethan Smith:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/ethan_l_s

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ethanls/

• Graphite: https://www.graphitehq.com/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Coda: https://coda.io/lenny

• Mixpanel: https://mixpanel.com/startups

• Lemon.io: https://lemon.io/lenny

—

Referenced:

• Product-Led SEO: The Why Behind Building Your Organic Growth Strategy https://a.co/d/2wkN4dx

• Topical Authority Analysis: https://bit.ly/topical-authority-tool

• SEO Link Analysis: https://bit.ly/diagnostic-internal-links

• SEO Links API: https://bit.ly/graphite-internal-links-api

• Screaming Frog: https://www.screamingfrog.co.uk/seo-spider/

• Brandon Lee of Power: https://www.linkedin.com/in/brandonhli

• Similarweb traffic analysis: https://www.similarweb.com/

• MasterClass: https://www.masterclass.com/

• BetterUp: https://www.betterup.com/

• NerdWallet: https://www.nerdwallet.com/

• HubSpot: https://www.hubspot.com/

• Ahrefs: https://ahrefs.com/

• Semrush: https://www.semrush.com/

• Google Search Console: https://search.google.com/search-console/about

• Clearscope: https://www.clearscope.io/

• Yuriy Timen on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/how-to-grow-a-subscription-business-yuriy-timen-grammarly-canva-airtable/

• Gokul Rajaram on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/gokul-rajaram-on-designing-your-product-development-process-when-and-how-to-hire-your-first-pm-a-playbook-for-hiring-leaders-getting-ahead-in-you-career-how-to-get-started-angel-investing-more/

• Luc Levesque on Twitter: https://twitter.com/luclevesque

• Search Off the Record: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/search-off-the-record/id1512522198

• GPT-3: https://gpt3demo.com/apps/openai-gpt-3-playground

—

In this episode, we cover:

(03:53) Ethan’s background

(07:53) Why technical audits are the biggest myth in SEO

(10:05) When to invest in SEO

(16:09) Heuristics to determine if SEO is worth it

(18:36) The three buckets of SEO: programmatic, editorial, and technical

(23:30) The process for creating an SEO strategy

(27:00) Why you shouldn’t be too formulaic 

(28:33) What is site engagement?

(29:31) Which pages need to be indexed

(31:49) Topics vs. keywords

(36:33) How to mine competitors’ sites for information

(37:41) Useful tools for developing your SEO strategy

(40:14) How long will it take to see results?

(45:16) Factors to consider when looking to hire an SEO person

(47:33) The functions of a programmatic SEO person

(49:19) How to do testing

(54:06) Editorial SEO strategy

(57:14) How to scale based on the size of the site

(59:51) Page types

(1:01:53) How to win in a topic category

(1:03:12) How to build solid hypotheses and test them 

(1:06:13) How to deal with roadblocks and advocate for resources

(1:08:54) How topical and domain authority are determined

(1:16:43) The power of internal links

(1:24:32) Why AI is not usually useful for content creation

(1:28:31) Final tips for getting started with SEO

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Petra Wille is an independent product leadership coach who’s been helping product teams expand their skill sets since 2013. She’s also the author of Strong Product People, which she published in 2021. Alongside her freelance work, Petra curates and co-organizes Mind The Product Engage Hamburg. She started her career as a software developer and in 2008 went to work at Xing, a German social media site, where she learned from two incredible product leaders: Marty Cagan and Jason Goldberg. In today’s podcast, we talk about Petra’s book, and how to help your team grow as a product leader. Petra also shares how to improve your storytelling skills, get better at public speaking, and why community is so important for product managers.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/how-to-be-the-best-coach-to-product

—

Where to find Petra Wille:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/loomista

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/petra-wille-b8b1329/?originalSubdomain=de

• Website: https://www.petra-wille.com/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Flatfile: https://www.flatfile.com/lenny

• Mixpanel: https://mixpanel.com/startups

• AssemblyAI: https://www.assemblyai.com/?utm_source=lennyspodcast&utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=nov27

—

Referenced:

• PMwheel framework: https://www.strongproductpeople.com/pmwheel

• Marty Cagan’s assessment: https://www.svpg.com/coaching-tools-the-assessment/

• PM Daisy: https://pmdaisy.com/

• The Eisenhower matrix for prioritization: https://www.productplan.com/glossary/eisenhower-matrix/

• Continuous Discovery Habits: Discover Products that Create Customer Value and Business Value: https://www.amazon.com/Continuous-Discovery-Habits-Discover-Products/dp/1736633309

• Mochary Method Curriculum: https://docs.google.com/document/d/18FiJbYn53fTtPmphfdCKT2TMWH-8Y2L-MLqDk-MFV4s/edit

• Matt Mochary on Lenny’s podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/videos/how-to-fire-people-with-grace-work-through-fear-and-nurture-innovation-matt-mochary/

• Hans Rosling’s Ted talks: https://www.ted.com/speakers/hans_rosling

• Sarah Kay: If I should have a daughter: https://www.ted.com/talks/sarah_kay_if_i_should_have_a_daughter?

• Nobody Wants to Read Your Sh*t: Why That is and What You Can Do About It: https://www.amazon.com/Nobody-Wants-Read-Your-Sh-ebook/dp/B01GZ1TJBI

• Selling the Dream: https://www.amazon.com/Selling-Dream-Guy-Kawasaki/dp/0887306004

• Nancy Duarte’s website: https://www.duarte.com/

• The 72 Rules of Storytelling: https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/72-rules-commercial-storytelling-jeremy-waite/

• The Art of Thinking Clearly:https://www.amazon.com/Art-Thinking-Clearly-Rolf-Dobelli/dp/0062219693

• Outcomes Over Output: https://www.amazon.com/Outcomes-Over-Output-customer-behavior/dp/1091173265

• Martin Erickson’s Decision Stack: https://martineriksson.com/the-decision-stack

• Present Yourself Kickstarter: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/womentalkdesign/present-yourself-a-public-speaking-book

• The Product Experience podcast: https://www.mindtheproduct.com/the-product-experience/

• Product podcast in German: https://www.produktmenschen.de/

• Watch New Amsterdam on Peacock: https://www.peacocktv.com/stream-tv/new-amsterdam

• Harvest bookkeeping and time tracking: https://www.getharvest.com/

• Qanto: https://qonto.com/en

—

In this episode, we cover:

(03:35) Petra’s background

(05:51) The things leaders of product teams don’t always understand

(09:33) Why Petra wrote the book Strong Product People to help managers of product teams 

(11:21) The five ingredient coaching method

(17:00) Why Petra usually recommends starting coaching with a development plan

(19:31) Why weekly time should be carved out for ‘people development’

(21:16) How to define a competent PM in your organization and tools to help you

(24:06) Petra’s PM Wheel and how she developed it

(27:36) Other info product leads will find useful in Petra’s book

(30:46) Tips for coaching your team

(35:17) How to improve your storytelling

(40:56) How to get better at public speaking

(44:45) Why it’s important to develop good storytelling and public speaking skills 

(53:36) The importance of a community of practice for product people

(56:14) Why people tend to stick around when they are supported and growing in a community

(57:53) What to look for in a community

(1:06:48) Lightning round

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Ian McAllister is the Senior Director of Product for Vehicles at Uber. Before moving to Uber, Ian spent over a decade directing teams at Amazon, where he created and led Amazon Smile. He was also Director of Product Management at Airbnb, where I was lucky enough to have worked alongside him. In today’s episode, we discuss Ian’s famous document about the essential attributes of the top 1% of product managers. Ian outlines the most important skills to focus on for entry-level PMs and how to broaden your experience and diversify skills as you move up the ladder. He also shares what he learned working with Jeff Wilke, Jeff Bezos, and other leaders at Amazon, and goes in depth on Amazon’s working-backwards framework. 

—

Where to find Ian McAllister:

• Newsletter: https://ianmcallister.substack.com/

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/ianmcall

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ianmcallister/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Mixpanel: https://mixpanel.com/startups

• Athletic Greens: https://athleticgreens.com/lenny

• AssemblyAI: https://www.assemblyai.com/?utm_source=lennyspodcast&utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=nov20

—

Referenced:

• What distinguishes the top 1% of product managers from the top 10%, on Substack: https://ianmcallister.substack.com/p/what-distinguishes-the-top-1-of-product

• What distinguishes the top 1% of product managers from the top 10%, on Quora: https://www.quora.com/What-distinguishes-the-Top-1-of-product-managers-from-the-Top-10

• Amazon’s working-backwards method: https://www.productplan.com/glossary/working-backward-amazon-method/

• Jeff Wilke on Twitter: https://twitter.com/jeffawilke

• Getting Real: The Smarter, Faster, Easier Way to Build a Successful Web Application: https://www.amazon.com/Getting-Real-Smarter-Successful-Application/dp/0578012812

• Wool (Wool trilogy #1): https://www.amazon.com/Wool-Trilogy-Howey-25-Apr-2013-Paperback/dp/B011T7ACU0/

• Energy and Civilization: A History: https://www.amazon.com/Energy-Civilization-History-MIT-Press/dp/0262035774

• How I Built This podcast: https://www.npr.org/series/490248027/how-i-built-this

• EV News Daily podcast: https://www.evnewsdaily.com/

• Yellowstone on Peacock: https://www.peacocktv.com/stream-tv/yellowstone

• Everything Everywhere All at Once on Showtime: https://www.sho.com/titles/3493875/everything-everywhere-all-at-once

• Gibson Biddle’s website: https://www.gibsonbiddle.com/

• Gibson Biddle on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/gibson-biddle-on-his-dhm-product-strategy-framework-gem-roadmap-prioritization-framework-5-netflix-strategy-mini-case-studies-building-a-personal-board-of-directors-and-much-more/

• Gibson Biddle’s Ask Gib newsletter: https://askgib.substack.com/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(03:54) What Ian expected from his initial post on product management

(05:30) How the post impacted Ian’s career

(07:06) How writing can help you crystallize your thoughts

(08:26) Ian’s background

(10:57) Attributes of the top 1% of PMs

(14:32) The top three skills for new PMs to perfect

(20:32) Tips on strengthening communication and prioritization

(23:06) How to level up as a PM

(26:37) What kind of impact should new PMs expect to make?

(29:36) How to broaden your view and think big

(33:06) How to earn the trust of others

(34:30) How Ian could have done more to earn trust at Airbnb

(37:27) Why people tend to stick around Amazon for a while 

(39:53) What Ian learned from Bezos and Wilke

(46:38) How teams get working backwards wrong

(53:51) The two parts of working backwards and how Ian utilizes it at Uber

(58:57) Lightning round

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Gergely Orosz writes the #1 technology newsletter at Substack, called The Pragmatic Engineer. He started his career as a software developer in the U.K., spent three years at Skype, and followed that role with four years as an engineering manager at Uber before deciding to leave big tech and work for himself. Gergely began pursuing his newsletter full-time in September 2021 and in just one year has amassed 200,000 subscribers. He now makes more money than he did at his salaried tech job, and with freedom and flexibility. In today’s podcast, Gergely shares why he left his well-paying job at Uber, how he got his first 1,000 subscribers, why this kind of work can be stressful and lonely (but ultimately rewarding), and why it takes hard work to build authority and become a great writer. Working solo can be challenging, and in this episode, both Lenny and Gergely offer tips for structuring your unstructured time and finding your focus.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/leaving-big-tech-to-build-the-1-technology

—

Where to find Gergely Orosz:

• Website: https://www.pragmaticengineer.com/

• Newsletter: https://newsletter.pragmaticengineer.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/GergelyOrosz

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/gergelyorosz/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Lemon.io: https://lemon.io/lenny

• Eppo: https://www.geteppo.com/

• Vanta: https://vanta.com/lenny

—

Referenced:

• Gergely’s books: https://blog.pragmaticengineer.com/books/

• Centered: https://www.centered.app/

• The Pomodoro technique: https://www.forbes.com/sites/bryancollinseurope/2020/03/03/the-pomodoro-technique/

• Coding Horror: https://blog.codinghorror.com/

• How to Achieve Ultimate Blog Success in One Easy Step: https://blog.codinghorror.com/how-to-achieve-ultimate-blog-success-in-one-easy-step/

• A Comment Is an Invitation for Refactoring: https://blog.pragmaticengineer.com/a-comment-is-an-invitation-for-refactoring/

• Kent Beck’s website: https://www.kentbeck.com/

• Steve Yegge’s famous rant on Google vs. Amazon: https://www.alexanderjarvis.com/steve-yegges-famous-rant-on-google-vs-amazon/

• Stevey’s Tech Talk: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLZfuUWMTtMcC1DZF6HxJhqsGrBXu8Jzi7

—

In this episode, we cover:

(04:32) Gergely’s background

(07:19) The Pragmatic Engineer, growth and current subscribers 

(08:59) Compensation with a subscription-based newsletter vs. his salaried position at Uber

(10:55) How the onset of Covid and layoffs at Uber prompted Gergely to start his newsletter

(23:10) What he did immediately after leaving Uber

(25:41) The day-to-day of writing a newsletter

(35:08) Tips for productivity

(41:19) Gergely’s favorite parts of entrepreneurship 

(43:15) The downsides of solo work

(50:39) Why Gergely stopped making long-term plans

(54:30) How to get started writing a newsletter

(1:04:48) Key advice on building a successful newsletter

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Alex Hardiman is Chief Product Officer at the New York Times, where she oversees the company’s news, cooking, games, audio and advertising products. Previously, Alex was Chief Business & Product Officer at The Atlantic, and before that she was Head of News Products at Facebook. We discuss how engineers and product people work with writers to create impactful stories, how teams build the incredible visualizations and experiences for NYTimes.com, how product teams are structured within the New York Times, and the good and bad about working at a company like the New York Times versus a FAANG tech company. We also talk about the details behind the New York Times’s acquisition of Wordle and uncover what the Times is dreaming up for its product over the next 10 years.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/an-inside-look-at-how-the-new-york

—

Where to find Alex Hardiman:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/alex_hardiman

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/alexandrahardiman/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Miro: https://miro.com/lenny

• Athletic Greens: https://athleticgreens.com/lenny

• Vanta: https://vanta.com/lenny

—

Referenced:

• Jodi Kantor: https://www.nytimes.com/by/jodi-kantor

• Wordle: https://www.nytimes.com/games/wordle/

• Wordle Is a Love Story: https://www.nytimes.com/2022/01/03/technology/wordle-word-game-creator.html

• Josh Wardle on Twitter: https://twitter.com/powerlanguish

• Eric Kim’s recipes: https://cooking.nytimes.com/ourcooks/eric-kim/

• Wirecutter: https://www.nytimes.com/wirecutter/

• Framing Britney Spears: https://www.nytimes.com/article/framing-britney-spears.html

• Hard Fork podcast: https://www.nytimes.com/2022/10/04/podcasts/hard-fork-technology.html

• High Growth Handbook: Scaling Startups from 10 to 10,000 People: https://www.amazon.com/High-Growth-Handbook-Elad-Gil/dp/1732265100

• An Elegant Puzzle: Systems of Engineering Management: https://www.amazon.com/Elegant-Puzzle-Systems-Engineering-Management/dp/1732265186

• The Revolt of the Public and the Crisis of Authority in the New Millennium: https://www.amazon.com/Revolt-Public-Crisis-Authority-Millennium/dp/1732265143

• Giovanni’s Room: https://www.amazon.com/Giovannis-Room-James-Baldwin/dp/0345806565/r

• The Daily podcast: https://www.nytimes.com/column/the-daily

• The Wire on HBO: https://www.hbo.com/the-wire

• Google Workspace: https://workspace.google.com/

• Slack: slack.com

• Figma: figma.com

• Mode: https://mode.com/

• GitHub: https://github.com/

• Fidji Simo on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/fidjisimo/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(04:48) Alex’s background

(07:37) How Alex fought disinformation on the news team at Facebook 

(11:11) How some product people thrive in chaos

(14:13) Alex’s return to the New York Times

(16:22) What product means at the New York Times

(20:42) How the product team at the New York Times is structured

(26:20) How the New York Times makes stories come alive with balanced creative and technical teams

(33:15) The acquisition of Wordle 

(42:00) What it was like to work at the New York Times during the onset of Covid

(47:11) How to avoid burnout on a product team

(49:26) How the New York Times has set itself apart with its subscription package

(52:21) How the New York Times’s products are rooted in helping in the real world

(52:54) Lenny’s tips for improving Wirecutter

(53:36) The differences and similarities on product teams in a news organization

(59:58) Lightning round

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Matt Mochary, CEO of Mochary Method, is a full-time executive coach who has worked with some of the biggest names in tech and finance, including investor Naval Ravikant and the CEOs of Notion, OpenAI, Coinbase, Reddit, and many others. In today’s podcast, we talk about the skill of firing people, why it’s so important, and Matt’s framework for approaching layoffs. We go deep on recognizing emotions like anger and fear, and what to pay attention to when you feel angry or fearful. He also shares how to build new products within a larger company, important tips on how to make sure everyone in the organization feels valued and heard, carving out time for your top goal, and how an energy audit can help you eliminate tasks that are draining your energy.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/how-to-fire-people-with-grace-work

—

Where to find Matt Mochary:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/mattmochary

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/matt-mochary-34bb4/

• Website: http://www.mochary.com/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• AssemblyAI: https://www.assemblyai.com/?utm_source=lennyspodcast&utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=nov10

• Lemon.io: https://lemon.io/lenny

• Vanta: https://vanta.com/lenny

—

Referenced:

• The Great CEO Within: The Tactical Guide to Company Building: https://www.amazon.com/Great-CEO-Within-Tactical-Building-ebook/dp/B07ZLGQZYC

• Mochary Method: https://mocharymethod.org/

• Leo Polovets on Twitter: https://twitter.com/lpolovets

• High Output Management: https://www.amazon.com/High-Output-Management-Andrew-Grove/dp/0679762884

• The Hard Thing About Hard Things: Building a Business when There Are No Easy Answers: https://www.amazon.com/Hard-Thing-About-Things-Building/dp/0062273205

• Andrej Karpathy on Lex Fridman’s podcast: https://lexfridman.com/andrej-karpathy/

• Wei Deng on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/dengwei/

• Free Solo: https://films.nationalgeographic.com/free-solo

• Ryan Hoover on Twitter: https://twitter.com/rrhoover

• Essentialism: The Disciplined Pursuit of Less: https://gregmckeown.com/books/essentialism/

• Make Time: How to Focus on What Matters Every Day: https://www.amazon.com/Make-Time-Focus-Matters-Every/dp/0525572422

• Centered app: https://www.centered.app/

• Diana Chapman at Conscious Leadership Group: https://conscious.is/team/diana-chapman

• The Mochary Method curriculum doc: https://docs.google.com/document/d/18FiJbYn53fTtPmphfdCKT2TMWH-8Y2L-MLqDk-MFV4s/edit

—

In this episode, we cover:

(04:43) Matt’s background

(07:39) Areas where even very successful founders struggle

(12:24) How to address people to minimize defensiveness

(13:24) The destructive nature of anger and how to feel your feelings so you don’t hurt others

(15:02) Which books led Matt to his coaching journey and software platform

(19:03) When and how to let an employee go

(31:47) How to make people feel heard

(38:05) How Matt’s coaching has evolved to include psychological obstacles to success

(39:41) What is “top goal,” and how can it help you make massive gains?

(41:25) Why Matt has an accountability partner for his top goal time

(43:44) How to approach mass layoffs humanely

(53:21) Matt’s thoughts on the Twitter layoffs

(54:10) How to innovate within a large company

(1:01:53) How to do an energy audit

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Ben Williams is VP of Product at Snyk, an industry-leading security platform for developers, last valued at $8.5b. He’s also a product and growth advisor with over 20 years of experience building and scaling high-performing product and growth teams. Through product-led growth, product-led sales, and community, Snyk rapidly scaled and won over the lucrative developer audience. In today’s episode, Ben shares the successful growth levers that helped Snyk get started, all of the details of how Snyk has structured their growth, product, and marketing teams and set them up for success in terms of cross-collaboration—and also how their initial plan for self-serve monetization fell flat. We go into Ben’s many useful tips for product-led growth, including his thoughts on free vs. paid versions, trials, and how to build amazing growth teams.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/how-snyk-built-a-product-led-growth

—

Where to find Ben Williams:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/semanticben

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/semanticben/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Coda: https://coda.io/lenny

• Athletic Greens: https://athleticgreens.com/lenny

• Vanta: https://vanta.com/lenny

—

Referenced:

• Snyk: https://snyk.io/

• Weekly Team Impact & Learnings Review Template: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1GibNaJ4aONgp5Kg824NCionr1citHIDk3FLvMdkpX_Q/edit?usp=share_link

• Monthly Group Impact & Learnings Review Template: https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1nQ18OTuRtc8urBnUWEObD_BlfdGDKlDDMFg8-G2GK7E/edit?usp=share_link

• Experiment Plan Template: https://docs.google.com/document/d/18LiGXKphGe1tUpZCQA20i4bJqf-S3kDbYnY4Pls_9kQ/edit?usp=share_link

• Vision & Mission Framework: https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1CiRwscu-50lBr2c7yRLY_zXVzv5DCnYqNnS5Au83WC8/edit?usp=share_link

• Ed Sim’s newsletter: https://whatshot.substack.com/

• Tamar Yehoshua on Twitter: https://twitter.com/tyehoshua

• Julian Shapiro on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/growth-tactics-retention-strategies-and-becoming-a-better-writer-julian-shapiro-demand-curve-hyper-webflow-techcrunch/

• Annie Duke’s website: https://www.annieduke.com/

• Elena Verna on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/elena-verna-on-how-b2b-growth-is-changing-product-led-growth-product-led-sales-why-you-should-go-freemium-not-trial-what-features-to-make-free-and-much-more/

• Growth loops: https://www.reforge.com/blog/growth-loops

• Brian Balfour on using learnings: https://brianbalfour.com/growth-machine/maximize-learning

• Adam Fishman on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/videos/how-to-build-a-high-performing-growth-team-adam-fishman-patreon-lyft-imperfect-foods/

• Amplitude: https://amplitude.com/

• FullStory: https://www.fullstory.com/

• User Interviews: https://www.userinterviews.com/

• User Testing: https://www.usertesting.com/

• Sprig: https://sprig.com/surveys

• Airtable: https://www.airtable.com/home/toolkit

• How to Measure Anything: Finding the Value of “Intangibles” in Business: https://www.amazon.com/dp/0470110120/

• Sprint: How to Solve Big Problems and Test New Ideas in Just Five Days: https://www.amazon.com/Sprint-Solve-Problems-Test-Ideas/dp/150112174X

• Make Time: How to Focus on What Matters Every Day: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B078QSCM3V/

• This Is How They Tell Me the World Ends: The Cyberweapons Arms Race: https://www.amazon.com/This-They-Tell-World-Ends/dp/1635576059

• Acquired podcast: https://www.acquired.fm/

• Turning Red on Disney+: https://www.disneyplus.com/movies/turning-red/4mFPCXJi7N2m

• Curb Your Enthusiasm on HBO: https://www.hbo.com/curb-your-enthusiasm

• Christine Itwaru’s blog: https://prodops.blog/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(04:44) Ben’s background

(07:27) What is Snyk, and what’s the current scale?

(08:45) Why Ben joined Snyk

(09:29) How Snyk got their first 100 users

(15:14) How Snyk used developer conferences and in-person meet-ups to launch

(19:23) How Snyk used GitHub as a growth lever

(23:50) Snyk Advisor, and other growth loops Snyk successfully used

(26:56) Snyk’s failed attempt at self-serve monetization

(31:21) How to win the hearts and minds of developers

(33:38) How adding sales and marketing teams helped Snyk gain momentum

(35:11) The evolution of Snyk’s growth team

(37:26) Snyk’s key areas of growth and how Ben solved tension between teams

(39:32) What is Snyk’s decision science team?

(40:59) Why Snyk has a growth marketer embedded on each team

(43:39) The importance of having an amazing SEO person

(46:21) Advice on building growth teams

(51:32) Ben’s vision and mission framework

(53:53) More on the growth process and experimentation

(56:04) Using learnings as a path to impact

(57:32) Growth strategy

(1:02:26) Data in growth teams

(1:06:33) How Snyk socializes learnings

(1:10:05) How Snyk structures their product org

(1:13:15) Free vs. paid features and how to approach trials

(1:18:57) Activation milestones at Snyk

(1:23:05) The most valuable tools for Snyk’s growth team

(1:25:21) Lightning round

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Lauren Ipsen is one of the most well-known and respected executive recruiters in the industry, having placed over 90 senior product leaders at companies including Twitter, Reddit, Opendoor, Postmates, Nextdoor, and many others. She is currently the Director of Executive Talent at General Catalyst, and prior to that was a senior leader at Daversa Partners. In today’s podcast, Lauren shares advice for founders on hiring senior product leaders, tips for product leaders on finding better opportunities, and the most common mistakes recruiters make. She talks about how to play the long game of networking to find the best talent and about recruiting best practices, and we also dive deep on market mapping, LinkedIn, and how to approach reference checks.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/lessons-from-one-of-the-worlds-top

—

Where to find Lauren Ipsen:

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lauren-ipsen-6a5a84113/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Retool: https://retool.com/lenny

• Miro: https://miro.com/lenny

• Vanta: https://vanta.com/lenny

—

Referenced:

• Gokul Rajaram on Lenny’s podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/gokul-rajaram-on-designing-your-product-development-process-when-and-how-to-hire-your-first-pm-a-playbook-for-hiring-leaders-getting-ahead-in-you-career-how-to-get-started-angel-investing-more/

• The Power of Now: A Guide to Spiritual Enlightenment:  https://www.amazon.com/Power-Now-Guide-Spiritual-Enlightenment/dp/1577314808

• You Are Here: Discovering the Magic of the Present Moment: https://www.amazon.com/You-Are-Here-Discovering-Present/dp/1590308387/

• Your Own Backyard podcast: https://www.yourownbackyardpodcast.com/

• Top Gun: https://www.amazon.com/Top-Gun-Tom-Cruise/dp/B001K3K5MO

• BeReal: https://apps.apple.com/us/app/bereal-your-friends-for-real/id1459645446

• Strava: https://apps.apple.com/us/app/strava-run-ride-hike/id426826309

• Spotify: https://apps.apple.com/us/app/spotify-music-and-podcasts/id324684580

• Joe Suliman at Daversa Partners: https://www.daversapartners.com/team/joe-suliman/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(04:46) Lauren’s background

(07:52) Why the best recruiters seem to be migrating to VC funds

(09:44) Mistakes founders make in searching for their first senior product leader

(13:26) Questions for founders to ask when thinking about who to hire

(16:07) The three main types of PMs

(18:27) What do job titles mean, and why are they more susceptible to change in a startup environment?

(21:50) What should product leaders do ahead of hiring senior product leaders?

(23:14) How to network with great talent

(27:37) Why the timetable for recruiting is variable

(29:02) How to be productive with your time by tapping your network

(30:27) Why recruiting via LinkedIn might not be the best use of your time

(33:17) Lauren’s favorite placement of all time

(37:30) The importance of diversifying your experience

(40:16) The art and science of staying long enough to have a meaningful impact

(43:23) The importance of creating real impact as a leader

(47:57) Good questions to ask references and how to dig deeper

(49:35) Resume red flags and the importance of honesty

(53:39) Interview tips for product managers 

(57:29) Common mistakes recruiters make

(1:00:57) Advice for founders looking for a recruiter

(1:04:24) Lightning round

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Sachin Monga is the Head of Product at Substack, a platform that I personally use every day, and love. Before Substack, Sachin co-founded an app called Cocoon, which he ended up selling to Substack. Before that, he spent over seven years at Facebook as a PM working on video and camera products, building out the developer platform, and leading the ads growth team. In today’s episode, we dive deep on all things Substack. Sachin shares what it’s like transitioning from a large product team at Facebook to a small growth team. He discusses how to work with a hands-on founder and why you must be comfortable with rapid change in a PM role. He also shares unique features of Substack that make it an optimized experience for readers and writers, how he’d like to see it improved, and tips for anyone wanting to get started writing online.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/building-substack-sachin-monga-substack

—

Where to find Sachin Monga:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/sachinmonga

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/sachinmonga/

• Email: Sachin@substackinc.com

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Retool: https://retool.com/lenny

• Stytch: https://stytch.com/lenny

• Vanta: https://vanta.com/lenny

—

Referenced:

• Substack: https://substack.com/

• Matt Taibbi on Substack: https://taibbi.substack.com/

• Bill Bishop on Substack: https://sinocism.com/

• Jasper: https://www.jasper.ai/

• DALL-E 2: https://openai.com/dall-e-2/

• 1000 True Fans: https://www.amazon.com/1000-True-Fans-Kellys-Simple-ebook/dp/B01N9P9O4G

• You Are Not Late: https://medium.com/message/you-are-not-late-b3d76f963142

• The Timeless Way of Building: https://www.amazon.com/Timeless-Way-Building-Christopher-Alexander/dp/0195024028

• Martyrmade podcast on Substack: https://martyrmade.substack.com/

• Colin Meloy on Substack: https://colinmeloy.substack.com/

• Ethan Strauss on Substack: https://houseofstrauss.substack.com/

• Kareem Abdul-Jabbar on Substack: https://kareem.substack.com/

• Dayne Rathbone: https://www.linkedin.com/in/daynerathbone/

• For All Mankind on Apple TV+: https://tv.apple.com/us/show/for-all-mankind/umc.cmc.6wsi780sz5tdbqcf11k76mkp7

—

In this episode, we cover:

(04:34) Sachin’s background

(07:11) The evolution and structure of teams at Substack

(10:11) What it’s like working at a smaller company with a hands-on founder

(12:07) How to share in a founder’s vision

(14:02) Why the rate of change is the most challenging aspect of the job

(16:37) Why prioritization at Facebook worked differently than it does at Substack

(20:03) How Substack thinks about prioritizing for writers and readers

(22:17) Substack’s recommendation feature and how it came to be

(27:13) How recommendations have led to an increase of millions of subscribers

(31:34) Moving forward with network-driven discovery 

(32:17) The “build with” principle and the product lab at Substack

(35:02) How Substack deals with negative press

(36:45) The writer experience at Substack

(39:13) The reader-focused experience on Substack

(40:41) Advice for writers

(44:45) Substack’s vision for making creation easier

(46:39) Common mistakes creators make, and how product improvements could help in some cases 

(49:57) Why you’re not too late to join the game

(52:52) Lightning round

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Barbra Gago is the founder and CEO of Pando, where she’s democratizing career progression. Previously she worked as the Chief Marketing Officer and Global Head of Marketing at Miro, where she helped create an entirely new software category for the space, and also served as VP of Marketing at Greenhouse, where she led go-to-market strategy. In today’s episode, we cover three main topics: category creation, branding and rebranding, and building opinionated software. Barbra discusses how she was able to rebrand Miro and launch a whole new category—and why her attempt to do that at Greenhouse failed. We cover the benefits of building your own category, and when it makes sense to do so and when it doesn’t. She also shares the importance of getting to know your users, why a great brand is informed by its values, and why Pando is built in an opinionated way.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/category-creation-and-brand-building-barbra-gago-pando-miro-greenhouse-culture-amp/#transcript

—

Where to find Barbra Gago:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/barbragago

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/barbragago

• Pando: https://www.pando.com/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• AssemblyAI: https://www.assemblyai.com/?utm_source=lennyspodcast&utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=oct27

• Stytch: https://stytch.com/lenny

• Vanta: https://vanta.com/lenny

—

Referenced:

• G2: https://g2.com/

• Software Advice: https://www.softwareadvice.com/

• Marketo: https://www.marketo.com/

• HubSpot: https://www.hubspot.com/

• Gainsight: https://www.gainsight.com/

• Greenhouse: https://www.greenhouse.io/

• Miro: https://miro.com/

• Gartner: https://www.gartner.com/

• Forrester: https://www.forrester.com/research/product-management/

• Oyster: https://www.oysterhr.com/

• Deel: https://www.deel.com/

• Atlassian: https://www.atlassian.com/

• Radical Candor: Be a Kick-Ass Boss Without Losing Your Humanity: https://www.amazon.com/Radical-Candor-Revised-Kick-Ass-Humanity/dp/1250235375

• The Art of War: https://www.amazon.com/Art-War-Sun-Tzu/dp/1590302257

• Kafka on the Shore: https://www.amazon.com/Kafka-Shore-Haruki-Murakami/dp/0099458322

• Cautionary Tales podcast: https://timharford.com/articles/cautionarytales/

• The Sandman on Netflix: https://www.netflix.com/title/81150303

• Nancy Duarte on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nancyduarte/

• Al Gore’s TED Talk: https://www.ted.com/talks/al_gore_the_new_urgency_of_climate_change

—

In this episode, we cover:

(04:04) Barbra’s background

(05:06) Barbra’s startup

(06:07) Category creation vs. winning in existing categories

(07:49) What is an applicant tracking system, and why have they been problematic?

(09:57) What is a product category?

(13:06) Examples of product categories

(14:05) Greenhouse as an example of failed category creation 

(16:46) How Miro successfully created a new category

(18:37) Utilizing user feedback

(21:15) The mechanics of category creation

(21:22) How to advocate for your new category with directory sites

(25:53) The middle ground between new and existing categories

(29:37) When is it time to rebrand?

(38:51) How to create a lasting, global brand

(41:18) How values inform brands

(43:13) Insights into developing company values

(44:24) The elements of a brand

(46:37) What is opinionated software?

(47:57) The benefits of opinionated software, and why Barbra’s software is opinionated

(51:23) Lightning round

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Fareed Mosavat is Chief Development Officer at Reforge, where he leads production, content, and new-product experiences. Previously, he led growth and product teams at Slack and Instacart, was a GM at Zynga, and also served as VP of Product at RunKeeper. Before all of that, Fareed’s fascinating career began in engineering for Pixar, where he learned the art of storytelling and collaboration. In today’s episode, we talk about how his time at Pixar influenced the way he thinks about product, why it’s so difficult to become a better PM, and how to avoid the “manager death spiral.” Fareed shares important insights on how to earn the trust of your manager and coworkers, the four types of product work—and why you need to understand all four. He also provides solid examples of how to generalize your learnings and explains why this will expand your options, make you a better PM, and boost your chances of moving into a leadership role. 

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/how-to-establish-credibility-and

—

Where to find Fareed Mosavat:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/far33d

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/fareed/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Coda: http://coda.io/lenny

• Amplitude: https://amplitude.com/

• Vanta: https://vanta.com/lenny

—

Referenced:

• Naval Ravikant’s Twitter thread about specific knowledge: https://twitter.com/naval/status/1002104865919664128

• Merci Grace on Lenny’s podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/merci-grace-ex-head-of-growth-at-slack-on-plg-interviewing-storytelling-building-a-diverse-team-hiring-salespeople-building-a-growth-team-and-much-more/

• “Crossing the Canyon: Product Manager to Product Leader,” by Fareed Mosavat and Casey Winters: https://www.reforge.com/blog/crossing-the-canyon-product-manager-to-product-leader

• Casey Winters on Lenny’s podcast: https://www.podpage.com/lennys-podcast/how-to-sell-your-ideas-and-rise-within-your-company-casey-winters-eventbrite/

• Reforge: https://www.reforge.com/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(00:38) Fareed’s background

(03:55) Lessons from Pixar

(09:07) What Fareed does at Reforge

(11:57) The scale of Reforge at this time

(13:51) Why it’s so difficult to become a better PM

(18:03) A PM pie chart—execution, generalizing your solutions, communication, and scaling

(23:00) How creating trust helped Fareed’s career grow

(26:24) How to gain trust by leveraging your curiosity and communication skills

(33:50) How to move from PM to Product Lead

(36:43) The manager death spiral and how to avoid it

(40:43) The four types of product work

(44:13) Moving from IC to product manager 

(47:15) How to ask for the proper resources

(50:00) The trend of senior PMs diversifying into advising, teaching, and angel investing

(57:20) The downsides of being your own boss

(01:00:45) Advice for breaking into advising

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Adriel Frederick is VP of Product Management at Reddit X, where he helps incubate and scale new products. He is a former Product Lead at Facebook, as well as a former PM and Director of Product at Lyft. In today’s episode, we focus on what it takes to become a better product leader. Adriel shares anecdotes from his time at Lyft and Facebook, insights about how to lead through tough times, why there isn’t an algorithmic solution to everything, why R&D teams need to be a part of the core mission, the tangible benefits of working on diverse teams, and his thoughts on the future of AI. He also introduces the concept of cannonballs, why you should focus on the marginal user, why organization and empathy are the most important PM skills, and so much more.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.podpage.com/lennys-podcast/humanizing-product-development-adriel-frederick-reddit-lyft-facebook/#transcript

—

Where to find Adriel Frederick:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/drellf

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/adrielfrederick/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Linear: https://linear.app/lenny

• Flatfile: https://www.flatfile.com/lenny

• Eppo: https://www.geteppo.com/

—

Referenced:

• Jules Walter on Twitter: https://twitter.com/julesdwalt

• Jules Walter’s guest post on Lenny’s newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/product-sense

• Mark Zuckerberg on The Joe Rogan Experience: https://open.spotify.com/episode/51gxrAActH18RGhKNza598

• Sam Harris’s TED Talk on AI: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8nt3edWLgIg

• Facebook’s 7 friends in 10 days: https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/how-chamath-palihapitya-dramatically-improved-user-malinda-senanayake/

• The Prize: The Epic Quest for Oil, Money & Power: https://www.amazon.com/Prize-Epic-Quest-Money-Power/dp/1439110123/

• The New Map: Energy, Climate, and the Clash of Nations: https://www.amazon.com/New-Map-Energy-Climate-Nations/dp/0143111159/

• Revisionist History podcast: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/revisionist-history/id1119389968

• Tuned In podcast: https://www.hpacademy.com/blog/tuned-in-high-performance-academy-podcast/

• Mo on Netflix: https://www.netflix.com/title/81134264

• Radiant Nuclear: https://www.radiantnuclear.com/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(00:40) Adriel’s background

(06:13) What he does at Reddit X

(07:27) Reddit X’s avatar marketplace and NFTs

(08:33) Why R&D teams need to be a part of the core mission

(11:12) What it’s like to be the first black PM at Facebook

(14:58) How to foster diversity

(19:40) Being a PM at controversial companies, and how to evaluate criticism

(28:25) Adriel’s most stressful time at Lyft

(30:35) The importance of operational control and what it means

(32:35) Why there isn’t always an algorithmic solution to everything

(37:47) Thoughts on AI

(42:42) Growth hacking and algorithms at Facebook

(48:18) Cannonballs in growth—fundamental changes in the product for optimization

(49:07) Facebook’s “7 friends in 10 days” push

(51:30) What is a marginal user, and what can you learn from their experience?

(56:06) How to think about doing experiments

(59:10) Why organization and empathy are the most important skills 

(1:02:59) Lightning round 

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Janna Bastow is a former product manager, and currently the CEO and co-founder of ProdPad. She also co-founded Mind the Product, a community for PMs, which has grown to 300,000 members across the world. In today’s podcast, Janna discusses the limitations of timeline-based Gantt charts and her “Now/Next/Later” framework. She also shares stories about hosting conferences and gives some great tips on how to improve your presentation skills and cope with performance anxiety.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/building-better-product-roadmaps-janna-bastow-mind-the-product-prodpad/#transcript

—

Where to find Janna Bastow:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/simplybastow

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jannabastow

• The ProdPad newsletter: https://www.prodpad.com/newsletter/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Formsort: https://formsort.com/lenny

• Coda: http://coda.io/lenny

• Amplitude: https://amplitude.com/

—

Referenced:

• Mind the Product: https://www.mindtheproduct.com/

• The Trouble with Traditional Roadmaps: https://www.prodpad.com/resources/guides/ditch-the-timeline-roadmap/the-trouble-with-traditional-timeline-roadmaps/

• ProdPad’s Sandbox: https://www.prodpad.com/sandbox/

• Geoffrey Moore’s product vision template: https://www.prodpad.com/blog/product-vision-template/

• The Art of Profitability: https://www.amazon.com/Art-Profitability-Adrian-Slywotzky/dp/0446692271

• The Sandman on Netflix: https://www.netflix.com/title/81150303

• Startups for the Rest of Us podcast: https://www.startupsfortherestofus.com/

• Christina Wodtke on Twitter: https://twitter.com/cwodtke

—

In this episode, we cover:

(01:10) Janna’s background

(05:28) How the community evolved at Mind the Product

(08:22) The tricky logistics of putting together a conference

(10:48) Are conferences profitable?

(13:00) How Janna developed her storytelling and presentation skills

(16:44) How to fight performance anxiety

(19:25) Mistakes are humanizing—how to power through and deliver your presentation

(22:11) The limitations of traditional timeline roadmaps

(25:00) Janna’s Now/Next/Later framework

(28:08) How to work without the structure of dated timelines, and why soft launches are important

(32:57) What great product teams are doing well

(35:05) The importance of retrospectives

(36:45) How to shift the culture at larger companies

(39:43) How ProdPad creates better product management practices

(42:04) How to learn the Now/Next/Later framework

(46:59) Geoffrey Moore’s product vision template

(48:36) Lessons for PMs interested in becoming founders

(50:48) Lightning round

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Adam Fishman has decades of experience building and scaling some incredible businesses, like Lyft, Patreon, and Imperfect Foods. He is currently an Executive in Residence at Reforge and an advisor to numerous companies on growth, product, strategy, and company building. In today’s episode, Adam shares his growth PM competency model to help founders identify specific skills when hiring growth leaders, how to structure feedback, and how to identify gaps in your growth team. He also discusses the role of onboarding in retention and how to evaluate a company as a prospective employee.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/how-to-build-a-high-performing-growth

—

Where to find Adam Fishman:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/fishmanaf

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/adamjfishman/

• Website: https://www.adamfishman.com/

• Adam’s newsletter: https://www.fishmanafnewsletter.com/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Linear: https://linear.app/lenny

• Coda: http://coda.io/lenny

• Eppo: https://www.geteppo.com/

—

Referenced:

• Stream Super Pumped on Showtime: https://www.sho.com/super-pumped

• Super Pumped: The Battle for Uber: https://www.amazon.com/Super-Pumped-Battle-Mike-Isaac/dp/0393652246

•  HitRecord: https://hitrecord.org/

• Adam’s growth competency model: https://www.reforge.com/blog/the-growth-competency-model

• Adam’s LinkedIn series: https://www.linkedin.com/posts/adamjfishman_ive-now-published-my-complete-series-on-activity-6979198793992802305-VtCu/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(00:18) Adam’s background

(06:16) Lyft’s launch press release 

(09:56) Adam’s newsletter and growth competency framework

(10:34) Myths and mistakes founders make

(15:12) The growth competency model 

(18:47) Customer knowledge and user psychology

(21:23) Why strategy and communication are more advanced competencies

(25:45) Why to hire a junior-level growth executive and how to support them

(31:20) Why Adam skews toward internal hiring

(33:25) Generalists vs. specialists

(35:59) The importance of onboarding

(41:49) Opinionated defaults

(45:03) Balancing conversion and retention with successful onboarding

(48:46) Guidelines for redesigning onboarding

(52:22) The PMF criteria for candidates

(57:57) What Adam would have done differently at Imperfect Foods

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Dan Hockenmaier is an expert on marketplace strategy and growth. He was previously the Director of Growth at Thumbtack as well as a partner at Reforge, where he co-created the monetization track. Currently, he is the Head of Strategy and Analytics at Faire. In today’s episode, Dan shares the building blocks of a growth model, important considerations when building your growth model, and how to get started. We also chat about retention best practices, the complexity of building a marketplace, the future of marketplaces, and when it makes sense to add a SaaS business to a marketplace, and vice versa.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/developing-a-growth-model-marketplace

—

Where to find Dan Hockenmaier:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/danhockenmaier

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/dan-hock/

• Website: https://www.danhock.com/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Amplitude: https://amplitude.com/

• Flatfile: https://www.flatfile.com/lenny

• Eppo: https://www.geteppo.com/

—

Referenced:

• Reforge: https://www.reforge.com/

• Casey Winters on Lenny’s Podcast: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/how-to-sell-your-ideas-and-rise-within-your-company

• Faire: https://www.faire.com/

• Dan’s blog post on the future of marketplaces: https://www.danhock.com/posts/the-future-of-marketplaces

• Careers at Faire: https://www.faire.com/careers

—

In this episode, we cover:

(00:43) Dan’s background

(04:01) What is a growth model?

(07:20) The building blocks of a growth model for your own business

(10:22) The value in building your own model

(11:12) The importance of retention over growth 

(14:49) Getting started building your model

(19:18) The growth model at Thumbtack

(20:36) The importance of the early user experience for retention

(25:02) Why is a marketplace a good business?

(28:23) Health metrics for marketplaces

(33:47) Supply and demand, and why you shouldn’t neglect demand

(36:23) The role of ROI equations and how to use them

(39:16) Why you should tread lightly when working with marketplaces

(42:43) Expanding marketplaces

(46:50) How marketplaces can add a SaaS offering, and why adding a marketplace to a SaaS business is trickier

(49:47) When is there an opportunity to unbundle?

(54:43) B2B marketplaces 

(56:36) What is fragmentation?

(58:46) The future of marketplaces

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Kristen Berman is the CEO and co-founder of Irrational Labs, where she helps companies like Google, Airbnb, PayPal, Microsoft, and LinkedIn improve their products and services through behavioral design research. She is also the co-founder of Common Cents Lab, a Duke University initiative dedicated to improving the financial well-being of low- to middle-class Americans. In today’s episode, Kristen shares the 3B Framework of Behavioral Design and uses real-life examples to illustrate what influences behavior change and the common biases that get in the way of building successful products. She also explains how to keep users engaged and how you can implement behavioral design research to drive innovation and growth.

—

Where to find Kristen Berman:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/bermster

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kristenberman/

• Website: https://irrationallabs.com/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Flatfile: https://www.flatfile.com/lenny

• Whimsical: https://whimsical.com/lenny

• Lenny’s Job Board: https://www.lennysjobs.com/talent

—

Referenced:

Learn more behavioral science:

• 3B Behavioral Design Framework https://miro.com/miroverse/3b-behavioral-design-framework

• Irrational Labs newsletter, with latest BE and behavioral design insights: https://irrationallabs.com/newsletter/ 

• Join the Behavioral Design Online Bootcamp (use code “Lenny” for 10% off): https://behavioraleconomicsbootcamp.com/

• Get the 3B Framework: https://irrationallabs.com/3bs-download/

• Behavioral Design & Diagnosis Cheat Sheet: https://irrationallabs.com/download-behavioral-design-guide/

• The 16 Critical Cognitive Biases (Plus Key Academic Research): https://irrationallabs.com/blog/cognitive-biases-and-academic-research/

• Behavioral Game Design: 7 Lessons: https://irrationallabs.com/blog/behavioral-game-design-7-lessons-from-behavioral-science-to-help-change-user-behavior/

• Predictably Irrational: The Hidden Forces That Shape Our Decisions:  https://www.amazon.com/Predictably-Irrational-Revised-Expanded-Decisions/dp/0061353248/

• Prolific testing platform: https://www.prolific.co/

• Kristen’s guest post on Lenny’s Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/people/23170097-kristen-berman

• Influence: The Psychology of Persuasion: https://www.amazon.com/Influence-New-Expanded-Psychology-Persuasion/dp/0062937650

• The Darwin Economy: Liberty, Competition, and the Common Good: https://www.amazon.com/Darwin-Economy-Liberty-Competition-Common/dp/0691156689/

• The Science of Change podcast: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-science-of-change/id1587407079

• No Stupid Questions podcast: https://freakonomics.com/series/nsq/

• Stream The Rehearsal on HBO Max: https://www.hbo.com/the-rehearsal

• Chris York’s website: https://www.chrisyork.co/

Case studies mentioned: 

• Budgeting fintech: https://irrationallabs.com/case-studies/budgeting/

• TikTok: https://irrationallabs.com/case-studies/tiktok-how-behavioral-science-reduced-the-spread-of-misinformation/

• One Medical: https://irrationallabs.com/case-studies/one-medical-case-study/

• Credit Karma: https://irrationallabs.com/case-studies/behavioral-design-credit-karma-money/

• TytoCare: https://irrationallabs.com/case-studies/tytocare-virtual-medical-visits/

• Kiva: https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/mind-guest-blog/the-deadline-made-me-do-it/

• When to Make Your Sign-Up Flow Harder: https://irrationallabs.com/blog/its-not-always-about-making-things-easier-when-to-make-your-sign-up-flow-harder/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(03:54) What is Irrational Labs, and what do they do?

(05:45) What are behavioral economics and behavioral design?

(06:50) The fintech budgeting experiment

(10:46) What drives behavior change?

(11:35) Why increasing friction can sometimes increase conversion

(13:51) How to ask the right questions for user engagement

(16:09) How Kristen got her start in behavioral economics

(18:10) The 3B model of behavior change

(20:37) Cognitive barriers

(22:02) The importance of building products with immediate benefits to the user

(24:20) How exploitation can occur

(26:45) How to set customer-friendly incentives

(29:15) How Kristen reduced the sharing of misinformation on TikTok

(31:58) Tips for researching and solving problems

(35:36) The One Medical case study 

(38:31) Rules of thumb for improving flow

(41:46) What is right-for-wrong?

(47:00) How to get started using behavioral design

(49:33) The Behavioral Design Bootcamp

(52:01) Lightning round!

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Georgiana Laudi is the co-founder and CEO of a consulting agency called Forget The Funnel, where she helps SaaS companies scale and improve conversion rates through customer-led growth. She’s also a marketing and growth advisor to companies like MarketerHire, SparkToro, and Sprout Social. Previously, she was the VP of Marketing at Unbounce and has worked in growth marketing for over 20 years. In today’s episode, Gia speaks about how to identify your ideal customer, how to map their user flows in order to find the biggest growth opportunities, and examples of product changes she’s recommended that have led to the largest growth unlocks. She shares the exact process she works through with founders to uncover opportunities, as well as how to increase subscriptions and retention for SaaS businesses.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/customer-led-growth-georgiana-laudi

—

Where to find Georgiana Laudi:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/ggiiaa

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/georgianalaudi/

• Website: https://www.forgetthefunnel.com/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Amplitude: https://amplitude.com/

• Athletic Greens: https://athleticgreens.com/lenny

• Maven: https://www.maven.com/lenny

—

Referenced:

• How SaaS Marketers Can Hold High-Impact Customer Research Interviews: https://www.forgetthefunnel.com/resources/saas-customer-research-interviews

• Jobs To Be Done: Email Invite Template & Interview Questions by Forget The Funnel: https://docs.google.com/document/d/183PzYjQi2vsIRlPMUrtzRwZF1VdnZWNDAZsrJ4MRT4Q/edit

• The Growth Framework for Customer-Obsessed SaaS Teams: https://www.forgetthefunnel.com/resources/saas-customer-journey-mapping

• Project Snow White: https://marker.medium.com/what-seven-years-at-airbnb-taught-me-about-building-a-company-e1d035d49c56#:~:text=middle%2C%20an[…]0White,-was%20one%20of

• Startupfest: https://startupfestival.com/for-startups/

• Pirate Metrics: https://fourweekmba.com/pirate-metrics/

• How Airbnb Proved That Storytelling Is the Most Important Skill in Design: https://www.inc.com/yazin-akkawi/the-surprising-technique-airbnb-uses-to-better-sell-an-experience.html

• Jobs to Be Done: https://jtbd.info/

• Demand-Side Sales 101: https://www.amazon.com/Demand-Side-Sales-101-Customers-Progress/dp/1544509987

• When Coffee and Kale Compete: https://www.amazon.com/When-Coffee-Kale-Compete-products-ebook/dp/B07C7HH662

• Obviously Awesome: How to Nail Product Positioning So Customers Get It, Buy It, Love It: https://www.amazon.com/Obviously-Awesome-Product-Positioning-Customers/dp/1999023005

• Hooked: How to Build Habit-Forming Products: https://www.amazon.com/Hooked-How-Build-Habit-Forming-Products/dp/1591847788

• Forget the Funnel: https://www.forgetthefunnel.com/customer-led-growth/book

• Four Thousand Weeks: Time Management for Mortals: https://www.amazon.com/Four-Thousand-Weeks-Management-Mortals/dp/B08XZY5ZF7

• Shine Theory: https://www.shinetheory.com/

• April Dunford’s website: https://www.aprildunford.com/

• SparkToro: https://sparktoro.com/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(04:33) Georgiana’s background

(07:03) Why funnels are antiquated 

(08:52) Better positioning and messaging to find the ideal customer

(13:59) How Gia was inspired by Airbnb’s storytelling

(19:23) How to analyze what’s successful and what to invest in

(21:54) The ideal customer to learn from

(26:37) How to choose which customer job to prioritize 

(32:21) Value moments in the customer relationship

(36:45) Applying customer feedback 

(44:40) Metrics for measuring the customer’s meaningful engagement 

(49:45) What’s included in the messaging and positioning guidebook

(51:15) Tips for messaging

(54:13) Example of a customer job at SparkToro

(55:58) What is the Jobs to Be Done framework?

(59:50) Lightning round

(1:04:18) How Gia manages her time

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Julian Shapiro is widely known as the founder of Demand Curve, where he’s helped thousands of companies figure out their growth strategy. He also wrote the growth marketing column at TechCrunch, was CMO at Webflow, and even created an animation engine called Velocity that’s now used in apps like Uber and WhatsApp. In today’s episode, Julian dives deep on product-led acquisition (PLA) and why he believes it’s the best way to grow your company. He shares specific marketing strategies for growth and retention and speaks about his framework for creating novel, engaging content, and how to choose topics for that content. He also discusses a framework called the Curiosity Faucet, inspired by prolific creators such as Ed Sheeran, John Mayer, Taylor Swift, and Neil Gaiman, to help you unlock your own creativity.

—

Where to find Julian Shapiro:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/Julian

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/julian-shapiro/

• Website: https://www.julian.com/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Amplitude: https://amplitude.com/

• Flatfile: https://www.flatfile.com/lenny

• Eppo: https://www.geteppo.com/

—

Referenced:

• Paul Graham’s Twitter: https://twitter.com/paulg

• Julian’s guide on startup growth channels: https://www.julian.com/guide/startup/growth-channels

• Topic selection: https://www.julian.com/guide/write/ideas

• Product-led acquisition: https://www.julian.com/guide/startup/product-led-acquisition

• Novelty: https://www.julian.capital/growth-strategy/content-marketing

• Julian’s example of counter-narrative novelty: https://twitter.com/julian/status/1348001396277186560

• Julian’s example of counterintuitive novelty: https://twitter.com/julian/status/1348001397753532416  

• On Writing Well: The Classic Guide to Writing Nonfiction:   https://www.amazon.com/Writing-Well-Classic-Guide-Nonfiction/dp/0060891548/

• Neil Gaiman Teaches the Art of Storytelling: https://www.masterclass.com/classes/neil-gaiman-teaches-the-art-of-storytelling

• Ed Sheeran, Songwriter: https://music.apple.com/us/music-movie/songwriter/1411353855

• John Mayer describes his songwriting process: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9cNRDWEXnrQ

—

In this episode, we cover:

(03:42) Julian’s background

(04:46) Why Julian hasn’t been tweeting frequently

(07:43) Advice for building a Twitter following

(09:53) The main reason Julian creates handbooks

(11:33) The difference between e-handbooks and newsletters

(13:25) What is product-led acquisition?

(16:20) The categories of product-led acquisition

(22:31) What is billboarding, and how can you take advantage of it?

(25:56) UGC—leveraging user-generated content for free advertising

(29:33) Strategies for retaining users

(38:36) How to keep novelty high in writing

(45:50) Julian’s framework for choosing writing topics

(54:35) The creativity faucet—how to unclog your pipes and get it going

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Jason Shah has led product teams at Amazon, Airbnb, Microsoft, and Yammer and currently leads the product team at Alchemy (one of the most important web3 infrastructure companies). In addition, he’s an advisor, investor, and two-time founder. In today’s episode, Jason discusses what it’s like to be a PM in web3, why his role at Amazon made such a big impact on his life and career, what makes a great leader, and how to hire well. He also shares his unique perspective on building a meaningful career and life.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/building-a-meaningful-career-jason

—Where to find Jason Shah:• Twitter: https://twitter.com/jasonyogeshshah• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jasonyogeshshah/• Website: https://www.jasonshah.me/—Where to find Lenny:• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/—Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:• Whimsical: https://whimsical.com/lenny• Coda: http://coda.io/lenny• Amplitude: https://amplitude.com/—Referenced:• Creative Selection: Inside Apple’s Design Process During the Golden Age of Steve Jobs: https://www.amazon.com/Creative-Selection-Inside-Apples-Process/dp/1250194466• Casey Winters on Lenny’s Podcast: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/how-to-sell-your-ideas-and-rise-within#details• Jason Shah in Lenny’s newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/a-product-managers-guide-to-web3• The Hard Thing About Hard Things: Building a Business When There Are No Easy Answers: https://www.amazon.com/Hard-Thing-About-Things-Building/dp/0062273205• Polygon: https://polygon.technology/• Solana: https://solana.com/• MoonPay: https://www.moonpay.com/• The Vietnam War series by Ken Burns: https://www.pbs.org/show/vietnam-war/• Alchemy: https://www.alchemy.com/—In this episode, we cover:(04:31) Jason’s background(08:19) The current state of web3(12:44) The evolution of product management in web3(15:27) The value of a great product manager(18:11) Why Amazon was a great learning experience (20:25) A look into Amazon’s process on working backward(23:55) How to communicate clearly(28:17) Working backward from excitement(32:46) What makes a great leader(38:26) How to influence a CEO or founder’s direction (46:19) The career ladder vs. career map framework(52:27) When to follow a new opportunity vs. when to stick it out(58:50) How to hire the right people(1:03:47) What skill is most important for product managers(1:06:49) Lightning round!—Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquires about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Adam Grenier is the former Head of Growth Marketing and Innovation at Uber, where he helped build Uber’s growth infrastructure from the ground up. He is also the former VP of Product and Marketing at LambdaSchool, and former VP of Marketing at Masterclass. These days, Adam is a growth and marketing advisor to many companies, as well as a teacher through Reforge. In today’s episode, Adam shares how to determine whether a new channel is worth exploring, the rise of the growth CMO, and how improv classes can improve team bonding and create a more positive ‘yes’ culture. He also speaks candidly about his own struggles with burnout and depression and shares some incredible tools that have helped him along the way.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/when-to-invest-in-new-acquisition

—

Where to find Adam Grenier:• Twitter: https://twitter.com/AKGrenier• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/akgrenier/—Where to find Lenny:• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/—Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:• Whimsical: https://whimsical.com/lenny• Coda: http://coda.io/lenny• Amplitude: https://amplitude.com/—Referenced:• OOT: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Over-the-top_media_service• Grin: https://grin.co/• Crossing the Chasm: Marketing and Selling High-Tech Products to Mainstream Customers: https://www.amazon.com/Crossing-Chasm-Marketing-High-Tech-Mainstream/dp/0060517123•Hacking Marketing: Agile Practices to Make Marketing Smarter, Faster, and More Innovative:  https://www.amazon.com/Hacking-Marketing-Practices-Smarter-Innovative/dp/1119183170• Adam’s twitter thread about burnout: https://twitter.com/akgrenier/status/1285275433282359296•Why Buddhism is True: https://www.amazon.com/Why-Buddhism-True-Philosophy-Enlightenment/dp/1439195455—In this episode, we cover:(00:35) Adam’s background(05:34) How improv can improve creativity and collaboration(13:09) What we’ll cover in this episode(13:52) Determining when an acquisition channel is a good match(25:38) Advice for how long to test a new channel(30:11) Emerging platforms that are worth exploring(36:53) Influencer marketing tools(37:55) When to broaden your audience(41:22) What is a Growth CMO?(49:36) Why marketing leaders should learn product development(51:32) Red flags that your CMO isn’t a good fit(55:33) Dealing with depression and burnout(1:03:00) Tools to help you through difficult times(1:05:20) Signs you’re facing burnout(1:07:15) What’s next for Adam—Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquires about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Emily Kramer led and built the marketing teams at Asana, Carta, Ticketfly, and Astro (acquired by Slack). These days, she’s the co-founder of MKT1, where she helps founders and marketers build and scale their marketing functions. Emily is also a well-respected angel investor and writes my favorite marketing newsletter (MKT1). In today’s episode, she shares her insights on when to hire marketers, how to determine which type of marketing hire is best for your team, how to best work with marketing, and what red flags to look for. Emily shares actionable templates and some incredible frameworks that are sure to expand your marketing knowledge.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/how-to-build-a-powerful-marketing

—

Where to find Emily Kramer:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/emilykramer

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/emilykramer/

• MKT1 Newsletter: https://mkt1.substack.com/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Amplitude: https://amplitude.com/

• Lenny’s Job Board: https://www.lennysjobs.com/talent

• Athletic Greens: https://athleticgreens.com/lenny

—

Referenced:

• Building an efficient marketing machine: the fuel & the engine: https://mkt1.substack.com/p/fuel-engine

• The GACC Marketing Brief: https://mkt1.substack.com/p/the-gacc-marketing-brief-the-best

• The Tipping Point: How Little Things Can Make a Big Difference: https://www.amazon.com/Tipping-Point-Little-Things-Difference/dp/0316346624

• Crossing the Chasm: https://www.amazon.com/Crossing-Chasm-3rd-Disruptive-Mainstream/dp/0062292986/

• Purple Cow: Transform Your Business by Being Remarkable: https://www.amazon.com/Purple-Cow-Transform-Business-Remarkable/dp/014101640X

• All the Light We Cannot See: https://www.amazon.com/All-Light-We-Cannot-See/dp/1501173219/

• The Daily podcast: https://www.nytimes.com/column/the-daily

• Stream Yellowjackets on Showtime: https://www.sho.com/yellowjackets

• CODA on Apple TV+: https://tv.apple.com/us/movie/coda/umc.cmc.3eh9r5iz32ggdm4ccvw5igiir

• Ashley Mayer’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ashleymayer/

• Kevan Lee’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kevanlee/

—

In this episode, we cover:

(03:44) Emily’s background

(06:08) Hiring a marketing team

(11:26) Examples of fuel and engine in marketing

(16:00) What is a product marketer?

(18:20) Why you should start with a marketing generalist 

(20:30) The difference between a growth person and a product person 

(23:57) What to look for in a product marketer

(26:58) When to hire a marketing person

(30:45) The role of a brand marketer

(33:24) Marketing for PLG startups

(36:22) What is product-led growth?

(39:23) How to get product and marketing to collaborate 

(43:38) What is the GACC framework?

(47:58 ) How to know if your marketing team is effective

(54:33) Why founders need angel investors with functional expertise

(1:00:23) Lightning round

—

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquires about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

Ryan J. Salva is the VP of Product at GitHub, where he led the incubation and launch of Copilot. Copilot uses OpenAI’s ML engine to suggest code and entire functions in real time, right from your editor, and is changing the way we build software. Ryan is an experienced developer and product manager, with over a decade of experience working for Microsoft before moving to lead the GitHub product team. In today’s episode, he shares how Copilot got its start, how it moved from prototype to live product, and how he structures R&D teams within larger companies. He also discusses the ethical questions surrounding AI use and how to build a successful product team, and shares the inside story of the development of Copilot.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/the-role-of-ai-in-new-product-development-ryan-j-salva-vp-of-product-at-github-copilot/#transcript

—

Where to find Ryan J. Salva:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/ryanjsalva

• LinkedIn : https://www.linkedin.com/in/ryanjsalva/

• Website: http://www.ryanjsalva.com/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Amplitude: https://amplitude.com/

• Athletic Greens: https://athleticgreens.com/lenny

• Modern Treasury: https://www.moderntreasury.com/

—

Referenced:

• GitHub Copilot: https://github.com/features/copilot

• Make It So: Interaction Design Lessons from Science Fiction: https://www.amazon.com/Make-So-Interaction-Lessons-Science/dp/1933820985

• Brief Interviews with Hideous Men: https://www.amazon.com/Brief-Interviews-Hideous-Foster-Wallace/dp/0316925195

• The Memory Palace podcast: https://thememorypalace.us/

• Arrival: https://www.hulu.com/movie/arrival-6ec67b11-b282-4383-85ac-38c4731b40e4

• Oege De Moor’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/oegedemoor/

—

In this episode, we cover:

[04:39] Ryan’s background and how he became involved in development

[10:46] What is GitHub Copilot?

[14:44] How GitHub Copilot can be utilized for education

[17:46] How GitHub incorporated AI models with computer languages

[27:24] Project horizons: delegating tasks based on confidence levels

[30:39] How to put together a development team for “moonshots”

[35:22] When and how to transition your R&D team smoothly

[38:28] Dealing with ethical issues surrounding AI

[44:40] The future of AI in development

[48:48] Challenges with scaling Copilot

[54:23] Allocating your energy as products scale

[58:17] Lightning round 

—

Production and marketing: https://penname.co/

Yuriy Timen was Global Head of Marketing and Growth at Grammarly, and is now a full-time growth advisor, having worked with more than a dozen companies, including Canva, Airtable, Whimsical, Otter.ai, Oyster, Flo Health, and Clay. In today’s episode, Yuriy discusses the ever-changing world of growth, emerging growth tactics, and how to find your growth engine. You’ll learn the most effective strategies for driving user acquisition, how to balance and diversify organic and paid channels, when it’s time to change plans, how to vet new growth channel opportunities, and much more.—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/transform-your-subscription-growth

—Where to find Yuriy Timen:• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/yuriytimen/• Twitter: https://twitter.com/thetimenator—Where to find Lenny:• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/—Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:• Flatfile: https://www.flatfile.com/lenny• Modern Treasury: https://www.moderntreasury.com/• Eppo: https://www.geteppo.com/—Referenced:• Casey Winters: https://www.linkedin.com/in/caseywinters/• Elena Verna: https://www.linkedin.com/in/elenaverna/• Lyka Pet Food: https://lyka.com.au/• Ethan Smith’s LinkedIn:  https://www.linkedin.com/in/ethanls/• Graphite: https://www.graphitehq.com/• Recast: https://getrecast.com/• Measured: https://www.measured.com/• INCRMNTAL: https://www.incrmntal.com/• Essentialism: The Disciplined Pursuit of Less: https://www.amazon.com/Essentialism-Disciplined-Pursuit-Greg-McKeown/dp/0804137382/• Man’s Search for Meaning: https://www.amazon.com/Mans-Search-Meaning-Viktor-Frankl/dp/0807014273/• The Splendid and the Vile: A Saga of Churchill, Family, and Defiance During the Blitz: https://www.amazon.com/Splendid-Vile-Churchill-Family-Defiance/dp/0385348711/• The All-In Podcast: https://www.allinpodcast.co/• Hustle: https://www.netflix.com/title/80242342• Mark Fiske at H.I.G.: https://higgrowth.com/team/mark-fiske/—In this episode, we cover:[03:49] Yuriy’s background[09:46] Different paths to growth for subscription-based products[13:21] When to lean into virality[15:39] What are network effects?[16:32] SEO strategy and timeline: how long can it take to see results?[24:22] The shifting landscape of paid media[28:09] The return of media mix modeling[32:01] How can you tell if media spending equates to business results?[33:44] Don’t spread yourself too thin[36:01] How to tell if you’ve taken a strategy far enough[38:02] When to lean into a strategy that’s working vs. when to think about diversification[42:13] Is there a shift from growth to survival?[46:19] Two reasons to do paid media[56:45] Why you shouldn’t dismiss TikTok (and other channels you might be overlooking)[59:36] Lightning round!—Production and marketing: https://penname.co/

Wes Kao has worked with Seth Godin (where she co-founded the altMBA and served as executive director), David Perell on his Write of Passage course, Professor Scott Galloway on Section4, and Morning Brew. Currently, she’s the co-founder of Maven, a cohort-based learning platform where I taught my own course. Wes is passionate about telling stories that stay true to the creator’s intentions while keeping your audience listening. In today’s episode, you will learn how to use state changes to keep your audience engaged, how to communicate more clearly by focusing on the how more than the why, how to manage up for success, and how to communicate your priorities to set a boundary.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/persuasive-communication-and-managing-up-wes-kao-maven-seth-godin-section4/#transcription

—

Where to find Wes Kao:

• Website: https://www.weskao.com/

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/wes_kao

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/weskao/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Modern Treasury: https://www.moderntreasury.com/

• Berbix: https://www.berbix.com/start

• Makelog: https://www.makelog.com/lenny

—

Referenced:

• The Super Specific How: How to make your cohort-based course more rigorous: https://www.weskao.com/blog/super-specific-how

• It Was the Best of Sentences, It Was the Worst of Sentences: A Writer’s Guide to Crafting Killer Sentences: https://www.amazon.com/Was-Best-Sentences-Worst-Crafting/dp/158008740X

• Guide to Better Business Writing (HBR Guide Series): https://www.amazon.com/HBR-Guide-Better-Business-Writing/dp/142218403X

• Seth Godin’s blog: https://seths.blog/

• The Minto Pyramid Principle: Logic in Writing, Thinking, and Problem Solving: https://www.amazon.com/Minto-Pyramid-Principle-Writing-Thinking/dp/0960191038

• Doctor Foster: https://www.amazon.com/Doctor-Foster/dp/B01DT0WQ2C

• Suzy Batiz: https://www.suzybatiz.com/

• Amanda Natividad’s Marketing 201 course: https://maven.com/amandanat/content-marketing

• Dr. Marily Nika’s course:  https://maven.com/marily-nika/technical-product-management

—

In this episode, we cover:

[03:39] Wes’s early career

[07:08] How to land a job with Seth Godin

[09:56] What makes Seth Godin stand apart

[14:50] Wes’s framework for better writing: the super-specific how

[18:08] Writing and teaching without the BS

[21:45] State changes: how to keep your audience engaged when teaching

[25:51] The data of “eyes light up” moments

[29:27] What managing up can do for you

[32:51] How to manage up effectively

[34:17] Lenny’s template for proactive communication

[36:19] The skills you need to communicate clearly through writing

[43:50] How to protect your bandwidth (without having to say no to your boss)

[47:32] How Lenny sets priorities and communicates them

[48:24] Lightning round!

—

Production and marketing: https://penname.co/

What are common diseases of product teams, and how do you avoid them? Why should you focus less on problem discovery and more on solution discovery? How do you maintain your product mojo? After working as a product leader for over 20 years, Marty Cagan started Silicon Valley Product Group to help product teams operate at a higher level. In this conversation, Marty shares what Steve Jobs can teach you about building product, how to structure your teams for innovation, how to improve your product culture, which trends in PM to ignore, and much more. After this, you’ll never think about building teams the same way. Join us.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/the-nature-of-product-marty-cagan-silicon-valley-product-group/#transcript

—

Where to find Marty Cagan:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/cagan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/cagan/

• SVPG: https://www.svpg.com/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Whimsical: https://whimsical.com/lenny

• Flatfile: https://www.flatfile.com/lenny

• Modern Treasury: https://www.moderntreasury.com/

—

Referenced:

• The Nature of Product: https://www.svpg.com/the-nature-of-product/

• Devolving From Good To Bad: https://www.svpg.com/devolving-from-good-to-bad/

• Shreyas Doshi: https://twitter.com/shreyas

• The Lost Interview: https://www.amazon.com/Steve-Jobs-Lost-Interview/dp/B01IJD1BES

• Continuous Discovery Habits: Discover Products that Create Customer Value and Business Value by Theresa Torres: https://www.amazon.com/Continuous-Discovery-Habits-Discover-Products/dp/1736633309

• Sprint: How to Solve Big Problems and Test New Ideas in Just Five Days by Jake Knapp: https://www.amazon.com/Sprint-Solve-Problems-Test-Ideas/dp/1442397683

• Patrick Collison on User Research: https://twitter.com/patrickc/status/1443215022029619200

—

In this episode, we cover:

[03:46] The biggest misconceptions about what a good product team does and looks like 

[07:49] The qualities that separate the best product teams

[16:20] The downfall of innovation in great product teams

[17:43] The gap between the best and the rest

[19:23] The pitfalls product teams can fall into

[27:46] The role of user research in building a great product

[35:26] What individual contributors can do to shift product culture

[41:04] How PMs can set themselves up for success when trying to change product culture

[44:06] How product management is changing

[55:33] The pitfalls Marty warns to watch out for in product management

—

Production and marketing: https://penname.co/

What makes a great brand? After working at Google and Square, Arielle Jackson has spent the past eight years consulting startups on how to create powerful messaging that works. In this jam-packed episode, she shares how to pick a winning name for your company, create a brand purpose that excites your team and customers, and position your company and its products for success. You don’t want to miss this one!

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/the-art-of-building-legendary-brands

—

Where to find Arielle Jackson:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/hiiamarielle

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ariellerjackson/

• Course: https://maven.com/arielle/startupbrandstrategy

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Flatfile: https://www.flatfile.com/lenny

• Unit: https://unit.co/lenny

• Athletic Greens: https://athleticgreens.com/lenny

—

Referenced:

• Positioning Your Startup Is Vital—Here’s How to Nail It: https://review.firstround.com/Positioning-Your-Startup-is-Vital-Heres-How-to-Do-It-Right

• Three Moves Every Startup Founder Must Make to Build a Brand That Matters: https://review.firstround.com/three-moves-every-startup-founder-must-make-to-build-a-brand-that-matters

• What I Learned from Developing Branding for Airbnb, Dropbox, and Thumbtack: https://review.firstround.com/what-i-learned-from-developing-branding-for-airbnb-dropbox-and-thumbtack

• Positioning: The Battle for Your Mind: https://www.amazon.com/Positioning-Battle-Your-Al-Ries/dp/0071373586

• Alchemy: The Dark Art and Curious Science of Creating Magic in Brands, Business, and Life: https://www.amazon.com/Alchemy-Curious-Science-Creating-Business/dp/006238841X

• The Vanishing Half: https://britbennett.com/the-vanishing-half

• The Mothers: https://britbennett.com/the-mothers

• Nik Sharma’s weekly newsletter: https://www.nik.co/subscribe

• How I Built This: https://www.npr.org/series/490248027/how-i-built-this

• In Depth: https://review.firstround.com/podcast

• Unseen Unknown: https://unseen-unknown.simplecast.com/

• Luca: https://movies.disney.com/luca

• Encanto: https://movies.disney.com/encanto

• Old Enough!: https://www.netflix.com/title/81506279

• The Sociology of Business with Ana Andjelic: https://andjelicaaa.substack.com

• David Ogilvy: https://www.oneclub.org/hall-of-fame/-bio/david-ogilvy

• Rory Sutherland: https://twitter.com/rorysutherland

• Seth Godin: https://seths.blog/

—

In this episode, we cover:

[04:04] From making jewelry as a side hustle to launching products for Square: Arielle’s background[12:32] What makes a good name for a product or a startup[19:17] How to come up with a great name[24:59] How to run a naming brainstorm for the best results[31:09] Bad names and naming mistakes[34:17] Arielle’s brand development framework and when founders should implement it[36:02] How do you know when brand development is completed?[41:17] How long should branding take?[42:42] How to build a brand purpose that ignites excitement[48:51] Specific tactics for building your brand purpose[51:12] How to master your positioning[55:22] Why it’s important to stay niche when you’re mastering your positioning[59:15] The process of positioning and Arielle’s bar test[1:02:38] How to build a brand personality using the five big brand descriptions[1:07:39] Where to put brand and product positioning documents so they’ll actually get used[1:09:14] How startups can get PR[1:14:49] When should you hire a marketer?—Production and marketing: https://penname.co/

Shishir Mehrotra is the co-founder and CEO of Coda, and formerly head of product and engineering at YouTube. In this episode, he shares his insights on growth strategy, how he evaluates talent, a peek at his upcoming book The Rituals of Great Teams, why reference checks are the most important step in the interview process, and so much more. Join us.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/the-rituals-of-great-teams-shishir-mehrotra-coda-youtube-microsoft/#transcript

—

Where to find Shishir Mehrotra:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/shishirmehrotra

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/shishirmehrotra/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Coda: http://coda.io/lenny

• Flatfile: https://www.flatfile.com/lenny

• Eppo: https://www.geteppo.com/— Referenced:

• The Rituals of Great Teams Braintrust: https://coda.io/@shishir/join-the-rituals-of-great-teams-braintrust

• Bing Gordon: https://www.kleinerperkins.com/people/bing-gordon/

• Switch by Chip Heath and Dan Heath: https://www.amazon.com/Switch-Change-Things-When-Hard/dp/0385528752

• PSHE diagram: https://coda.io/@shishir/pshe

• Understanding Comics by Scott McCloud: https://www.amazon.com/Understanding-Comics-Invisible-Scott-McCloud/dp/1627652736

• Only Murders in the Building: https://www.hulu.com/series/only-murders-in-the-building-ef31c7e1-cd0f-4e07-848d-1cbfedb50ddf

• WandaVision: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WandaVision

• Fidji Simo: https://twitter.com/fidjissimo

• Daniel Ek: https://twitter.com/eldsjal/

• Reid Hoffman: https://twitter.com/reidhoffman?

• Mamoon Hamid: https://twitter.com/mamoonha

• Quentin Clark: https://twitter.com/quentinclark

• Sarah Guo: https://twitter.com/saranormous

—In this episode, we cover:[4:13] Shishir’s background at Google and current role at Coda[7:53] How Shishir got on the board of Spotify[8:58] Black loops and blue loops and how Coda uses this internal diagram [9:52] The black loop is how a product is naturally shared[12:15] The blue loop is the emotional loop on why products are shared[14:55] Why you should think in loops instead of funnels[18:20] Mining for your business’s loops by looking at what you tell job candidates[24:37] Shishir’s upcoming book The Rituals of Great Teams [26:30] The 3 golden rituals of teams[27:10] Coda’s golden ritual: Dory and Pulse[31:29] Shishir’s most impactful rituals: Arianna Huffington’s reset, Gusto’s incredible hiring call, and Coinbase’s Rapids[40:38] How you find your own team’s rituals[42:50] How to change things when change is hard[45:01] Airbnb’s unique rituals[46:45] A backstory on YouTube, and valuing consistency over comprehensiveness[53:00] Eigenquestions: What they are, how to use them, and examples[59:05] One of Shishir’s favorite retired interview questions [1:03:11] How to evaluate talent, a story about YouTube, and breaking down PSHE[1:15:20] How to approach reference checks and what questions to ask[1:24:33] Favorite books[1:25:50] Favorite TV shows and movies[1:26:50] Favorite interview questions[1:28:44] Who in the industry Shishir respects as a thought leader[1:30:10] His go-to karaoke song[1:30:40] Where you can find Shishir— Production and marketing: https://penname.co/

Thousands of new products launch each year, but very few make it. Ryan Hoover has seen thousands of products launched over the course of his time running Product Hunt, and through his investing, and in this episode you’ll hear what Ryan has learned about launching products, growing products, and raising capital. Plus, we play a made up game called “What would you rather upvote?” Join us.

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• RevenueCat: https://www.revenuecat.com/

• Flatfile: https://www.flatfile.com/lenny

• Lenny’s Giveaway Bonanza: https://lennyspodcast.com/bonanza

—

Where to find Ryan Hoover:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/rrhoover

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ryanrhoover/

• Website: https://www.ryanhoover.me/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

In this episode, we cover:

[03:23] On being a tech celebrity 

[09:02] Using Twitter DM’s as a content machine

[11:15] The questions most founders ask 

[14:48] When should you start a company?

[18:28] Would Ryan raise money for Product Hunt if he could do it again?

[21:48] When should companies launch products?

[24:52] What makes a launch successful versus not?

[26:27] How to get to the top of Product Hunt

[30:01] What skill is most helpful for moving into investing and venture capital?

[31:39] What Ryan would do differently if he could re-build Product Hunt

[38:57] What matters most in life

[43:13] Which ideas Ryan would upvote

[48:05] What founders of consumer companies do to succeed

[55:33] Deciding to serve a niche or broad market

[58:03] The surprising parts of angel investing

[1:02:12] Advice for folks wanting to get into angel investing

Do you put as much time into your career planning as you do into your product planning? Deb Liu has had an extraordinary career path, from Ebay and PayPal, to Facebook, and now Ancestry. She’s sat in on, mentored, and managed hundreds of product managers. In this episode, she shares poignant advice on how to intentionally find growth opportunities and drive your career forward. Join us.

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Flatfile: https://www.flatfile.com/lenny

• Amplitude: https://amplitude.com/

• Makelog: https://www.makelog.com/lenny

—

Where to find Deb Liu:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/debliu_

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/deborahliu/

• Substack: https://debliu.substack.com/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Referenced:

• Take Back Your Power: 10 New Rules for Women at Work (Deb’s Book): https://www.amazon.com/Take-Back-Your-Power-Rules/dp/031036485X

• How To Change Your Life Through Resolutions: https://debliu.substack.com/p/resolve-to-progress

—

In this episode, we cover:

[04:32] What it was like when eBay acquired PayPal

[07:31] Quirky culture clashes as the companies merged

[09:46] How incentives drive employee behavior

[14:43] How Deb took on a product management role at a young age

[17:51] PayPal’s hiring strategy for early growth

[20:03] How to succeed as an introverted leader

[25:29] What sets successful Product Managers apart from one’s who plateau

[27:09] Specific tactics for unlocking growth in your Product Management career

[32:06] How to find and create mentorship circles

[36:30] The most important skill for early Product Managers to focus on

[43:58] How to grow your confidence in communication

[46:55] Deb’s upcoming book "Take Back Your Power"

[50:35] One tactical tip from Deb’s upcoming book on how to improve your Product Management

[52:09] How to get involved with Women In Product

[57:11] How companies can recruit more diverse Product Managers

[1:00:04] How Deb built Facebook marketplace from scratch

[1:06:03] The blessing and curse of gaining a lot of users quickly

You don’t need lots of employees to achieve impressive growth—but you do need a unique approach to hiring and structuring your team, and accurately measuring your growth efforts. Crystal Widjaja has used scrappy tactics to unlock massive success for Gojek (a wildly successful ride-share app in South East Asia) and is currently the Chief Product Officer at Kumu. In this episode, she shares the exact strategies she’s used as a product leader to hack growth, hire the best, and perfect data collection. Join us.

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Amplitude: https://amplitude.com/

• Flatfile: https://www.flatfile.com/lenny

• Eppo: https://www.geteppo.com/

—Find the full transcript at: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/how-to-hire-for-measure-and-unlock—

Where to find Crystal:

• Website: https://www.crissyw.com/

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/crystalwidjaja

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/crystalwidjaja/

—

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

—

Referenced:

• Generation Girl: https://www.generationgirl.org/

• Experiment Design Question Example: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1tSrEGpvg19OMKrRg45HGvsZBGz8BkeVc/edit#gid=1841057518

—

In this episode, we cover:

[00:00] Crystal’s path to product

[09:40] How Crystal decided to join a risky startup 

[11:31] Why haven't super apps emerged in the U.S.? 

[13:15] What startups in the U.S. can learn from companies in Asia

[16:35] How to get intentionally scrappier in your organization

[18:28] How to get and utilize scrappy and small data sets 

[21:26] How to increase retention

[22:28] What does and doesn't work in growth?

[25:01] The conversion rates Crytsal looks for to determine viability and success

[28:03] How founders should think about approaching growth

[32:44] Figuring out how to grow and the resources you have at your disposal

[34:53] Optimizing the funnel to make growth happen faster

[37:40] Crystal's biggest lessons on unlocking growth

[40:07] Why most analytics efforts fail and how to avoid failure

[44:24] Signs your organization is getting analytics wrong

[46:17] The best resources for figuring out how to do analytics right

[47:05] Crystal's recommendations for metric tracking stacks.

[48:37] How you should set up your growth team originally

[51:38] Integrating growth teams or separating them?

[52:43] Who should be the first growth hire?

[53:55] How to hire a great growth person for your organization

[56:55] How to help women and young girls get into STEM (a non-profit that you started)

[1:02:07] Where to reach Crystal 

Every company wants to develop a winning strategy—but what are signs your strategy isn’t working, and how do you change course? Melissa Perri has worked trained PMs and product leaders at nearly all the Fortune 100 companies, and in this conversation shares how to reset a struggling strategy, align your team, and build winning strategy. Join us.

—

Find the full transcript here: https://www.podpage.com/lennys-podcast/how-to-create-a-winning-product-strategy-melissa-perri/#transcript

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Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Amplitude: https://amplitude.com/

• RevenueCat: https://www.revenuecat.com/

• Makelog: https://www.makelog.com/lenny

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Where to find Melissa:

• Website: https://melissaperri.com/

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lissijean

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/melissajeanperri/

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Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

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Referenced:

• Melissa’s Book: https://melissaperri.com/book

—

In this episode, we cover:

[00:00] What to expect with guest Melissa Perri

[02:57] Melissa’s incredibly vast experience working with product manager’s 

[04:20] Melissa’s current focus: training and education of PM’s

[05:59] The most common problems that product teams face

[09:48] When to hire your first CPO

[14:27] What to do before hiring a CPO

[16:16] When to bring an interim CPO consultant like Melissa

[21:26] Signs your team doesn’t have a strategy

[22:59] Identifying your vision, strategy and intentions as a company

[27:48] Signs you’re doing a bad job as a PM

[30:30] The process of defining strategic visions

[33:28] How to hone your craft as a PM

[43:55] Melissa’s Book — Escaping the Build Trap: How Effective Product Management Creates Real Value 

[48:43] How to avoid burnout 

[52:19] Where to find Melissa

Advancing as a product leader requires new skills and a new mindset. Ken Norton is an executive coach who works with some of the top people in product to help them get unstuck and find creativity again in their approach to problems and their careers. After 14 years as a Product Manager at Google, Ken brings deep experience in leadership and shares with us the lessons he most often offers his clients to unlock growth. Join us.

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Amplitude: https://amplitude.com/

• Lenny’s Job Board: https://www.lennysjobs.com/talent

• Unit: https://unit.co/lenny

—Find the full transcript at: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/how-to-unlock-your-product-leadership—

Where to find Ken Norton:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/kennethn

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kennethnorton/

• Product Leadership Coaching: https://www.bringthedonuts.com/coaching/

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Where to find Lenny:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

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Books and Resources Recommended By Ken:

• Dare To Lead by Brene Brown  • 15 Commitments of Conscious Leadership • Mastering Leadership by Bob Anderson • Immunity to Change by Robert Kegan • Stop Telling Women They Have Imposter Syndrome • Innovator’s Dilemma by Clayton Christensen 

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In this episode, learn:

[00:00] What to expect in this episode with Ken Norton[03:10] Why Ken will never get tired of donuts[05:05] Ken’s career path and what he does with executive coaching now[08:00] What Ken learned from his own executive coach[12:02] Driving a car and the metaphor of learning a new skill[16:20] How Ken’s helping leaders shift their mindset[19:41] Creative vs reactive leadership mindset[22:15] How your underlying beliefs impact your leadership style[33:50] Mindset and authenticity and their role within leadership[39:00] What you can do if you can’t spend a lot on coaching[42:05] Resources Ken recommends (linked in notes)[44:22] Biggest blindspots people have[48:10] Why doing the hard thing, may be the best thing[49:20] What to do with imposter syndrome[58:40] Ways to find a coach[1:01:03] 10x vs 10%[1:05:35] Ken’s one piece of advice for hiring a product manager[1:13:00] How to find Ken

The people who rise fastest in product know how to sell their ideas to customers, and also to their coworkers. Casey Winters, the Chief Product Officer at Eventbrite (previously at Grubhub, Pinterest, and advisor to dozens of companies) shares what it takes to be successful as you rise in the ranks within product. In this episode we’ll talk about how to land presentations, how to win over executives with strategic communication, the skill sets that are most in demand in product, and new growth trends. Join us.

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Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Coda: http://coda.io/lenny

• Mixpanel: https://mixpanel.com/startups

• Whimsical: https://whimsical.com/lenny

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Where to find Casey Winters:

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/onecaseman

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/caseywinters/

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Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

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In this episode, learn:

[00:00] What to expect in this episode with Casey Winters 

[03:23] An overview of Casey’s career  

[06:18] A look into the most-fulfilling and challenging roles Casey has energized 

[06:50] Communicating upward

[11:18] How to derisk meetings

[13:53] Are you properly preparing for your meetings?

[19:09] Striving for perceived simplicity 

[24:22] Justifying non-sexy product improvements 

[27:47] Protecting what you’ve built vs continuously scaling 

[31:03] The downfall of functional ops roles

[35:21] The CPO role: what it is and how to get there

[40:44] The spectrum of product people

[45:11] How to level up your skills

[47:01] New growth trends, tactics, and strategies 

[50:32] Casey’s two stages of growth: kindle strategies and fire strategies

[51:51] Under appreciated growth strategies 

[54:02] Where to find Casey  

Nickey Skarstad is a Director of Product Management at Duolingo, where she is leading a stealth 0 → 1 product. Prior to Duolingo, she was VP of Product at The Wing, Product Lead at Airbnb, where she led much of the Experiences product team, Product Lead at Shopify, and Director of Product Management at Etsy.

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Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Mixpanel: https://mixpanel.com/startups

• Dovetail: https://dovetailapp.com/lenny

• Unit: https://unit.co/lenny

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In this episode:

[3:32] An overview of Nickey’s career

[7:39] What she learned from building product at Airbnb

[8:42] How to maintain and operationalize product quality

[9:44] Metrics that help you maintain quality

[20:08] Which company has most informed her product development approach

[21:57] How to structure your product org

[24:47] Should you go GM vs. functional

[27:18] How you set vision, translate that into goals, and then execute on it

[32:30] Brainstorming advice

[35:04] How to use OKRs effectively

[37:57] How to get better at influence as a PM

[41:23] How to know if a decision is a one-way or two-way door

[42:29] Second-order decisions, and second-order thinking

[46:35] Operationalizing principles

[47:17] Getting your team on board with your strategy

[49:39] Designing a product review meeting

[54:08] Tips for working remotely as a PM

[56:44] Lightning round

—Find the full transcript at: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/nickey-skarstad-airbnb-etsy-shopify—

Where to find Nickey:

• Newsletter: https://nickey.substack.com/

• TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@nickeyskarstad

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nickeyskarstad/

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/NickeySkarstad

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Referenced:

• Thinking in Systems by Donella H. Meadows

• Anne Helen Petersen

• Superhuman

• Loom

Manik Gupta has led two of the most successful consumer products in history—Google Maps, where he was Director of product for the Maps team, and Uber, where he was CPO. After leaving Uber, he spent some time working on a product to help people avoid getting COVID called CVKey, and most recently he took on a role at Microsoft as Corporate Vice President leading many of their consumer efforts.

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Mixpanel: https://mixpanel.com/startups

• Coda: http://coda.io/lenny

• Unit: https://unit.co/lenny

—

In this episode, we cover:

[3:55] Patterns for career success

[7:19] Why it’s valuable to be optimistic about technology

[13:54] Challenges and mistakes through Manik’s career

[17:28] How you learn the most about yourself through challenges

[20:25] What Manik’s learned about building successful consumer apps

[26:18] The importance of company-product fit

[30:02] “The consumer stack”—what your company needs to have in place to build a successful consumer product

[36:22] The path from PM to CPO

[39:19] Evolution of CPO role

[44:40] What leads to promotions in a PM career

[47:58] What creates inflections in one’s PM career

[52:05] How PMs shoot themselves in the foot

[55:05] What it’s like to work at Google vs. Uber vs. Microsoft

[1:01:35] What he wished he built into Google Maps

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Where to find Manik:

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/manikg/

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/manikgupta

Merci Grace has been a founder, an investor (at Lightspeed Ventures), head of product and growth (at Slack), and is now a founder again (Panobi). She’s also one of the co-founders of Women in Product, and Fast Company named her one of the Most Creative People in 2017.

—

Thank you to our wonderful sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Dovetail: https://dovetailapp.com/lenny

• Mixpanel: https://mixpanel.com/startups

• Whimsical: https://whimsical.com/lenny

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In this episode, we cover:

[3:41] Merci’s path to Head of Product and Growth at Slack

[4:42] What Merci learned from being a VC that helps her be a better founder

[6:50] How to tell a compelling story

[9:43] What most people don’t know about Slack

[10:27] Why Slack hasn’t created a consumer/social product

[15:14] How Slack innovated the PLG motion

[17:14] Slack’s early growth strategy

[19:57] Slack’s activation point

[22:10] Why it’s important to find connectors within a company

[26:40] Lessons from optimizing Slack’s onboarding flow

[32:12] Most common mistakes in going PLG

[35:56] Signs you can go PLG

[38:10] PLG vs. bottom-up

[40:23] Importance of day-zero value in your tool

[42:17] When to bring in your first salesperson

[44:47] How to hire amazing people

[50:21] Storytelling and Slack’s culture

[51:04] How and when to build a growth team

[52:08] How to build a more diverse team

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Where to find Merci:

• Panobi: https://panobi.com/

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/merci/

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/merci

• Website: https://mercigrace.co/

• Women in Product: https://www.womenpm.org/

Sanchan Saxena is VP of Product at Coinbase. Before Coinbase, Sanchan was Head of Product and GM at Airbnb, founder and Head of Product of Instagram Shopping, Director of Product Management at Yahoo, and Lead PM at Microsoft.

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Thank you to our sponsors for making this episode possible:

• Dovetail: https://dovetailapp.com/lenny

• Persona: https://withpersona.com/lenny

• Productboard: https://www.productboard.com/

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In this episode, you’ll learn:

[3:50] How Sanchan worked his way up to VP of Product at Coinbase

[6:15] Sanchan’s best advice to early-stage PMs

[9:41] What to look for in a company to join

[12:09] What Sanchan learned from Airbnb

[16:40] Behind the scenes of how Airbnb survived the Covid downturn when travel completely stopped

[21:49] How Airbnb tactically planned in two-week cycles

[25:00] How to keep morale up during a disaster

[29:00] What Sanchan learned from Brian Chesky, Brian Armstrong, and Kevin Systrom

[36:08] How to know when to trust your gut vs. A/B testing

[41:57] How Coinbase makes decisions

[46:30] How teams use the RAPID decision-making process

[47:00] How to operate in an ambiguous industry like web3

[49:00] How to know if you should get into web3

[51:46] How to hire and close amazing candidates

[54:40] What to look for in product leaders

[57:13] Lightning round

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Where to find Sanchan:

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/sanchans/

• Twitter: https://twitter.com/sanchans