The Lawfare Podcast

This week, Ben discusses recent events in cybersecurity with Matt Tait. Matt shared his views on WannaCry, NotPetya, and what companies and governments can do to protect against such attacks in the future.

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Today, Shane Harris of The Wall Street Journal published an article entitled "GOP Operative Sought Clinton Emails From Hackers, Implied a Connection to Flynn." He sat down with Benjamin Wittes to discuss the story in this special edition of the podcast.

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This week, in Israel, Ben had two conversations about the television show Fauda. On Tuesday, Ben spoke with Avi Issacharoff, the show's co-creator and a journalist at the Times of Israel and Walla!. Then, on Thursday, Ben talked to Brig. Gen. Dov "Fufi" Sedaka, a former Israeli special operator and former head of the Civil Administration in the West Bank. With each, Ben discussed Fauda's portrayal of the complicated lives of Israeli special operators, as well as perceptions of the show in Israel and the Palestinian territories.

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This week, the Lawfare Podcast brings you Jack Goldsmith's interview with Dan Drezner at the Hoover Book Soirée about Drezner's new book, The Ideas Industry: How Pessimists, Partisans, and Plutocrats are Transforming the Marketplace of Ideas.  The conversation covers how polarization, inequality, and mistrust are changing the way ideas influence policy and public opinion.

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Attorney General Jeff Sessions faced questioning from the Senate Intelligence Committee today. He answered questions on his recusal, on his role in James Comey's firing, on his disputed conversation with the former FBI Director, and on his meetings with Russian Ambassador Sergey Kislyak. He also declined to answer a lot of questions about his conversations with President Trump—without an assertion of executive privilege.

We stripped out all the extraneous material, leaving just the questions and answers: no repetition, no senatorial speechifying.

We left in every question that produced new information, and that's all we left in. It's everything you actually need from today's hearing in 90 minutes.

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As the dust settles following former FBI Director James Comey’s testimony before the Senate Intelligence Committee, the Lawfare Podcast brings you expert views on what exactly happened yesterday and what it means for the Trump administration going forward. Benjamin Wittes sat down with Carrie Cordero, a former attorney at the National Security Division of the Justice Department, and Paul Rosenzweig, who worked for Independent Counsel Kenneth Starr, for a conversation on the Comey testimony and its implications.

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In much-anticipated testimony today, former FBI Director James Comey spoke before the Senate Intelligence Committee on the subject of his many interactions with President Donald Trump prior to his dismissal. The testimony took up a tight three hours, but there were still plenty of repetitions and instances in which the former director was unable to answer questions in an open session. To save you from all that, we at Lawfare are providing you with a bare-bones, just-the-facts version of Comey's testimony today. It's the distilled version of what we've all been waiting to hear.

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With the impending sunset of Section 702 of the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act in December 2017, debate is heating up over how the crucial intelligence-gathering provision will be reauthorized by Congress—and even if it will be reauthorized at all. At the Hoover Institution, Benjamin Wittes sat down with former Director of the National Counterterrorism Center Matt Olsen to talk about the intelligence community's perspective on 702 and what lies ahead for it in these turbulent times.

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Just before the holiday weekend, as you were drifting out of town, the Washington Post dropped its 15 kiloton Kushner bomb. Over the weekend, the New York Times piled on, and by the time we got here this morning, there was only one thing to do: A special edition of the podcast.

Carrie Cordero, Susan Hennessey, and Benjamin Wittes talked through the details of the latest bizarro revelations about the attempted secret back channel between the Trump transition and the Russians, using Russian diplomatic technical means. 

If you'd like to read Carrie's Lawfare post on the Kushner story, you can find it here. 

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Amidst the hurricane of news coming out of the White House in recent weeks, one question has surfaced again and again: why isn't White House Counsel Don McGahn stopping Donald Trump from doing all this? This week on the podcast, Benjamin Wittes sat down with Bob Bauer, former White House Counsel for Barack Obama, to talk about the Office of the White House Counsel and how President Trump can and can't be restrained.

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It's been a long and stressful week on the domestic front, so we at the Lawfare Podcast are bringing you a podcast on a cheerier subject: the looming crisis on the Korean Peninsula. Benjamin Wittes sat down with Mira Rapp-Hooper, Senior Fellow with the Asia-Pacific Security Program at the Center for a New American Security, to chat about the recent series of escalating North Korean missile tests and the crisis we're all being distracted from. 

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It has been, to put it mildly, a busy week. So perhaps we shouldn't be surprised that when Benjamin Wittes sat down with former attorney general to President George W. Bush Michael Mukasey and former Obama White House Counsel Neil Eggleston this morning at a Federalist Society panel on the unitary executive, Mukasey and Eggleston made some news of their own—pointedly criticizing the Trump White House's recent handling of the Russia investigation and the dismissal of FBI Director James Comey. Now we're bringing you audio of the panel on a special edition of the Lawfare Podcast, featuring Mukasey and Eggleston's expert thoughts on recent news events as well as their considerations of the state of the unitary executive. 

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This afternoon, the Washington Post broke a major story: Donald Trump disclosed highly classified material to the Russian ambassador and Foreign Minister in the Oval Office last week, compromising a highly sensitive counterterrorism program run by an allied intelligence service. This evening, we got former DNI General Counsel Robert Litt on the line for a discussion with Susan Hennessey and Benjamin Wittes of the latest mess. Litt helped coordinate and manage the intelligence community's response to the Edward Snowden revelations, so he knows a little something about responding to massive intelligence disclosures. We talked about how bad the disclosure may be, what the remedies for it are, and what we still don't know. 

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It’s been a long week, so after our special emergency edition on the firing of FBI Director James Comey, the Lawfare Podcast is coming to your rescue with an episode that has nothing at all to do with the crisis at the FBI. Instead, take a listen to Jack Goldsmith’s interview of Mark Moyar at the Hoover Book Soiree about Moyar’s new book, Oppose Any Foe: The Rise of America’s Special Operations Forces. The conversation delves into the history of special operations forces and how they’ve been used and misused over time.

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The sound quality is, well, substandard, and we apologize for that. But people on Twitter were asking for an emergency podcast on FBI Director James Comey's firing today, and we put together an incredible group to discuss the day's events. In a recorded conference call this evening, we heard from—in addition to the two of us—Jack Goldmith, who knows a little something about confrontations between the White House and Justice Department officials; Carrie Cordero, who knows a little something about national security investigations (having served at NSD for years); and Paul Rosenzweig, who knows a little something about special prosecutor investigations (having served under Independent Counsel Kenneth Starr). By the time you listen to this, it may be out of date, but we're confident it's the best discussion you'll hear on the subject tonight.

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Three months into the Trump presidency, where does the relationship between the President and the intelligence community stand? Donald Trump is no longer quite so regularly combative in his tweets and public comments about the various intelligence agencies, but the White House-intelligence community relationship is still far from normal under this very unusual presidency. Here to ponder the question are former NSA and CIA director General Michael Hayden, former acting and deputy director of CIA John McLaughlin, and former deputy national security advisor for combating terrorism Juan Zarate, who spoke with the Washington Post’s David Ignatius in a recent event at the Aspen Institute.

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Four years on, the cultural differences between Europe and the United States exposed by Edward Snowden’s disclosures of NSA surveillance programs still loom large in transatlantic relations. At our most recent Hoover Book Soiree, Benjamin Wittes sat down with Russell Miller—editor of a new volume on Privacy and Power: A Transatlantic Dialogue in the Shadow of the NSA-Affair— and Ralf Poscher—who, along with Ben, contributed a chapter to the book—to chat about privacy and surveillance oversight post-Snowden.

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Over the past year, Lawfare has expended a great deal of ink on the problem of sextortion, a form of online sexual assault in which perpetrators obtain explicit images or video of their victims and use those images to extort further explicit content. We even brought Mona Sedky, a Justice Department prosecutor who focuses on sextortion cases, onto the podcast to discuss her work. Now, we’re pleased to feature Mona on the podcast once again with audio of her talk last week at George Washington University Law School on prosecuting sextortion.

If you’re interested in reading our Brookings Institution reports on sextortion, you can find them here and here.

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As our dependence on cyberspace increases, so too will the urgency of crafting good cybersecurity policy—but the combination of knotty problems in the realms of both technology and law often makes these issues particularly difficult to iron out. In this episode of the podcast, Susan Hennessey sits down with Trey Herr, Fellow with the Belfer Center's Cyber Security Project at the Harvard Kennedy School; Jane Chong, Deputy Managing Editor of Lawfare and National Security and Law Associate at the Hoover Institution; and Robert M. Lee, nonresident national cybersecurity fellow at New America, to chat about a new book on the subject: Cyber Insecurity: Navigating the Perils of the Next Information Age. Co-edited by Trey and Richard Harrison, Director of Operations and Defense Technology Programs at the American Foreign Policy Council, and with chapters by Jane and Robert, the book seeks provides a practitioner's roadmap to cybersecurity policy.

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On Friday, March 31st, the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence held its first open hearing in its investigation into Russian interference in the U.S. election on "Disinformation: A Primer in Russian Active Measures and Influence Campaigns." The experts before the committee, including Eugene Rumer, Roy Godson, Clint Watts, Kevin Mandia, General Keith Alexander, and Thomas Rid, gave a useful rundown of the scope and mechanics of Russian influence. There's just one problem: their testimony ran five hours long. So once again, we've cut down the hearing to a snappy two hours, bringing you just the good parts. 

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At this week's Hoover Book Soiree, Samuel Tadros of the Hudson Institute and the Hoover Institution sat down with Graeme Wood to discuss his new book, The Way of the Strangers: Encounters with the Islamic State. The book both situates ISIS within context of Islamic history and theology and chronicles Wood's meetings with ISIS supporters and sympathizers across the world in an effort to understand what's behind the group's pull. It's a useful complement to the news coming out of Iraq and Syria as we begin to consider what the future of ISIS will look like after the fall of Raqqa and Mosul.

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Between leading the House Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence's first open hearing on Russian election interference on Monday, and sparring with HPSCI Chairman Rep. Devin Nunes over Nunes's odd escapades regarding possible incidental collection of communications of Trump associates, HPSCI Ranking Member Rep. Adam Schiff has had a busy week. On Tuesday, Lawfare and the Brookings Institution were pleased to host Rep. Schiff for an address on "The Role of Congress in Protecting Liberal Democracy." In conversation with Lawfare's Benjamin Wittes and Susan Hennessey, Rep. Schiff spelled out an ambitious legislative program and a vision for revitalizing the power of Congress under the Trump presidency. 

If you're interested in reading Rep. Schiff's remarks, Lawfare has published them here in article form.

On April 6th, Lawfare will be convening the third annual joint live podcast taping with Rational Security and the Steptoe Cyberlaw Podcast at the Triple Entente Beer Summit. Tickets are available here. We'd love to see you there!

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Yesterday, FBI Director James Comey and NSA Director Admiral Mike Rogers testified before the House Intelligence Committee on Russian interference in the U.S. election for an exhausting five and a half hours. They made a lot of news, but there were also a lot of refusals to comment and speeches made by members of the Committee. So we've cut down their testimony to less than an hour, giving you only what you need to know. 

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President Donald Trump has pledged to end the defense sequester and make the development of defensive and offensive cyber capabilities a White House priority, but the contours of U.S. cyber policy under the new administration have yet to be set—in fact, the administration still hasn't released its much-heralded Executive Order on cybersecurity, though several drafts have been leaked. So what should we expect to see from the new administration regarding cybersecurity?

To answer that question, we're bringing you audio from a conference hosted by Lawfare with the Hoover Institution in Washington and Intel Security and featuring a keynote address from Steve Grobman, Chief Technology Officer at Intel, along with a panel discussion on cybersecurity and Congress moderated by Carrie Johnson of NPR with Hill staffers including Brett DeWitt, Hope Goins, Allen Souza, Michael Bahar, and Brett Freedman. 

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This week on the podcast, Jack Goldsmith sat down with former Director of the National Counterterrorism Center Matt Olsen to talk about the current state of national security. What should we make of the president's tweeted allegations of politically motivated wiretapping? Of the revised executive order restricting entry into the United States from six majority-Muslim countries? Of the most recent release by Wikileaks? Of Trump's persistent attacks on the integrity of the intelligence community? Jack and Matt are here, if not to explain things, then at least to talk them through.

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Yesterday, Just Security and the Center on Law and Security at New York University School of Law hosted Benjamin Wittes for a conversation on a question he and I have posed about the path of the Trump presidency so far: what happens when we can’t take the president’s oath of office seriously?

Ben’s talk focused on an essay by him and myself that went up on Lawfare simultaneously, in which we argued that the presidential oath—little discussed though it may be in constitutional jurisprudence and academic literature—is actually the glue that holds together many of our assumptions about how government functions. And when large enough numbers of people cause to doubt the sincerity of the president’s oath, those assumptions begin to crumble.

Many thanks to Ryan Goodman of Just Security and Zachary Goldman of the Center on Law and Security for putting together this event. Make sure to also read Ryan’s Just Security followup post on his post-talk discussion with Ben and the questions raised by our essay.

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Under the oversight of Paul Lewis, the Department of Defense’s Special Envoy for Guantanamo Closure under the Obama administration, the detainee population at Guantanamo Bay went from 164 to 41. But Guantanamo remains open, and the Trump administration has promised not only to halt any further transfers or releases of detainees, but also to possibly bring in more detainees in the future. Benjamin Wittes sat down with Paul to discuss his time as special envoy and what’s next for Guantanamo under President Trump.

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Amidst the chaos surrounding Michael Flynn’s departure as national security advisor and the slowly unspooling news story on the Trump team’s reported contacts with the Russian government, it’s worth taking a step back and remembering a previous political controversy involving the Kremlin: Edward Snowden’s asylum in Moscow. In his recent book How America Lost Its Secrets: Edward Snowden, the Man and the Theft, Epstein argues that Snowden was effectively acting as a Russian spy, though he believes it’s not clear when and to what extent Snowden came under Russian influence. Benjamin Wittes sat down with Epstein at the Hoover Book Soiree to chat about the book and discuss its more controversial elements.

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Donald Trump's election as president brought a surge of interest in the previously obscure Emoluments Clause, which prohibits any “Person holding any Office of Profit or Trust under [the United States]” from accepting “any present, Emolument, Office, or Title, of any kind whatever, from any King, Prince, or foreign State.” Norm Eisen and Richard Painter, ethics experts for Presidents Barack Obama and George W. Bush, have been leading the charge to hold Trump accountable under the Emoluments Clause for his failure to divest of his businesses. Recently, they filed suit against him in their capacity as chair and vice-chair of the good government group Citizens for Responsibility and Ethics in Washington. Benjamin Wittes chats with Norm about the Emoluments Clause, the lawsuit, and what all this has to do with national security.

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On Monday, Acting Attorney General Sally Yates ordered the Justice Department not to defend President Trump's executive order banning refugees and immigrants from seven majority-Muslim countries, only to be quickly fired by Trump. Jack Goldsmith and Marty Lederman, who have both served in senior positions in the Office of Legal Counsel, penned responses—Jack criticizing Yates's actions and Marty defending them. We got them on the line for a special edition of the Lawfare Podcast. 

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President Trump kicked off the first foreign policy crisis of his new administration by signing an executive order mandating the construction of the much-promised border wall with Mexico, resulting in as-yet-unresolved confusion as to how the wall will be paid for and an ongoing diplomatic scuffle with Mexican President Enrique Peña Nieto. Benjamin Wittes spoke with Stephanie Leutert, the Mexico Security Initiative Fellow at the University of Texas at Austin and writer of Lawfare's "Beyond the Border" series, to chat about what the wall might look like, how effective it will or won't be, and what this means for U.S.-Mexico relations. 

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On January 13th, Benjamin Wittes and Emma Kohse released a new paper challenging the assumption that "privacy is an eroding value," worn away by the incessant collection of online data about consumer habits. Their paper, "The Privacy Paradox II: Measuring the Privacy Benefits of Privacy Threats," uses empirical data from Google consumer surveys to study how many people actually experience the technologies often accused of eroding privacy as increasing their privacy instead. 

In an event at the Brookings Institution, Ben sat down with Stewart Baker of Steptoe & Johnson and Amie Stepanovich of Access now to discuss the paper. This week, we're bringing you that conversation on the podcast. 

One note: Ben's opening remarks reference Powerpoint slides containing the survey results, which you can view in the paper itself—available here.

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Jameel Jaffer, author of The Drone Memos: Targeted Killing, Secrecy, and the Law, joins Jack Goldsmith at the Hoover Book Soiree. 

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In an interview with The New York Times before his intelligence briefing on Russian efforts to interfere in the U.S. election on Friday, President-elect Donald Trump called the intelligence community's assessment of Russian interference a "political witch hunt." In that spirit, we brought Lawfare managing editor Susan Hennessey and former GCHQ information security specialist Matt Tait on the podcast to discuss evidence of Russian attempts to influence the presidential election and Trump's baffling response. 

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Whatever the President-elect might say on the matter, the question of Russian interference in the presidential election is not going away: calls continue in the Senate for an investigation into the Kremlin's meddling, and the security firm CrowdStrike recently released new information linking one of the two entities responsible for the DNC hack with Russia's military intelligence agency. So how should the United States respond?

In War on the Rocks, Evan Perkoski and Michael Poznansky recently reviewed the possibilities in their piece "An Eye for an Eye: Deterring Russian Cyber Intrusions." They've also written on this issue before in a previous piece titled "Attribution and Secrecy in Cyber Intrusions." We brought them on the podcast to talk about what deterrence of Russian interference would look like and why it's necessary. 

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The annual Cato Surveillance Conference kicked off this week with a panel on "Intelligence Under a Trump Administration," featuring former Director of the National Counterterrorism Center Matthew Olsen and Lawfare's own Susan Hennessey, Timothy Edgar, and Carrie Cordero. In a discussion moderated by Shane Harris of The Wall Street Journal (and Rational Security), the group discussed how Trump's antagonistic approach to the intelligence community and his dismissive attitude toward intelligence briefings will shape the coming administration. 

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The Lawfare Podcast has made it to our 200th episode! Thank you to all our listeners, old and new.

This week at the Hoover Book Soiree, Jack Goldsmith interviewed Christopher Moran, a professor at the University of Warwick, on his book Company Confessions: Secrets, Memoirs, and the CIA. Moran's work is a history of CIA memoirs, but it's also a history of the Agency itself and its efforts to shape its image in the public eye. How does an organization whose work depends on keeping secrets justify its efforts within a democratic society?

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Earlier this week, the New York Times published a story by Charlie Savage, Eric Schmitt, and Mark Mazzetti informing us that the Obama administration had changed its interpretation of the 2001 Authorization for the Use of Military Force to more broadly cover the use of force against al-Shabaab, expanding its previous reading of the AUMF as only authorizing force against members of al-Shabaab individually linked to al-Qaeda. Bobby noted the story on Lawfare and provided a few comments. While the news has been somewhat drowned out amidst the hubbub of the presidential transition, the significance of this change in legal interpretation shouldn't be lost—so we brought Bobby and Charlie Savage on the podcast to talk with Benjamin Wittes about where this change came from and what it might mean.

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This week on the podcast, we’re bringing you some post-Thanksgiving food for thought on the uncertain state of the Arab world. On November 21, Madeleine Albright, Tamara Cofman Wittes, Stephen Hadley, and Amr Hamzawy sat down at the Brookings Institution to discuss a new report on “Real Security: Governance and Stability in the Arab World." What lead to the breakdown of governance across Arab countries? What can be done to establish more stable governance and increase security? And what role does the United States have in all of this?

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At this week's Hoover Book Soiree, Benjamin Wittes sat down with Bill Banks, Professor of Law at Syracuse University and the Founding Director of the Institute for National Security and Counterterrorism, to talk about Bill's book with Stephen Dycus, Soldiers on the Homefront: The Domestic Role of the American Military. The book examines how both law and culture has shaped and constrained the military's domestic activities, reviewing the legal history of the various different roles that soldiers have played at home, from law enforcement to martial law. Given the widespread concern over the strength of the next administration's commitment to civil liberties and the rule of law, it's a conversation that's unfortunately more relevant than ever. 

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This week, the Lawfare Podcast brings you a joint episode of the show together with Rational Security. The usual Rational Security gang—Shane, Ben, Tamara, and Susan—reflect on the results of the election and ask: What national security themes drove Donald Trump's supporters? What challenges does Trump face forming a government? And how will America’s allies react to his election?

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Two weeks ago, Lawfare’s Jack Goldsmith sat down with David Priess at the Hoover Institution for a Hoover Book Soiree on Priess’s new book, The President’s Book of Secrets: The Untold Story of Intelligence Briefings to America’s Presidents from Kennedy to Obama. While the book is framed as a study of the history of the President’s Daily Brief, it’s also a history of the American intelligence community since WWII and a history of how presidents deal with intelligence organizations.

Consider this Lawfare's gift to you: you don't have to suffer through yet another podcast about what's going to happen on November 8th. We're all stressed and stir-crazy over here, too. Take a listen to the podcast and give yourself a break from worrying. 

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On Thursday, October 20th, the D.C. Circuit Court of Appeals ruled once again on the case of Ali Hamza al-Bahlul, a Guantanamo detainee convicted by a military commission for inchoate conspiracy to commit war crimes. In a divided and inconclusive en banc decision, the D.C. Circuit affirmed Bahlul’s conviction, overturning the court’s decision vacating the conviction last June, in which a three-judge panel held that Bahlul could not be convicted of the domestic law offense of conspiracy as a war crime because Article III of the Constitution only permits military commission trials of offenses against the international laws of war. The Lawfare Podcast has covered the twists and turns of Bahlul’s case in the past, and now we’re back once more with Steve Vladeck of the University of Texas School of Law and Bob Loeb, a partner at Orrick, Herrington and Sutcliffe and the former Acting Deputy Director of the Civil Division Appellate Staff at the Department of Justice.

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On October 19th, Samuel Moyn, Professor of Law and History at Harvard University, closed out a one-day conference on “The Next President's Fight Against Terror” at New America with a talk on “How Warfare Became Both More Humane and Harder to End.” He argues that we’ve moved toward a focus on ending war crimes and similar abuses rather than a focus on preventing war’s outbreak in the first place. And in his view, the human rights community shares culpability for this problem. It’s an issue that will be of great consequence as the next president takes office amidst U.S. involvement in numerous ongoing military interventions across the globe.

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When audio dropped last Friday of Donald Trump boasting of attacks on women, the news quickly eclipsed another, just-as-important election story released right alongside it: reports that the United States government had decided to formally lay the blame for the recent hacking of Democratic Party information at the Kremlin's feet. In any other year, Russia's apparent attempts to interfere with the U.S. presidential election would be the biggest story of the moment. Thankfully, we at Lawfare were able to bring in our own Jack Goldsmith and Susan Hennessey to talk about Russia's hacking and leaking, its apparent probing and scanning of state-level electoral systems, and the U.S. government's confusion regarding what on earth to do about it.

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Stephanie Leutert, the Mexico Security Initiative Fellow at the University of Texas at Austin and the author of Lawfare's Beyond the Border series, joined Benjamin Wittes on this week's podcast to talk about the epidemic of violence plaguing Mexico and Central America. Despite the crisis going on immediately to our south, those of us in the United States who work and think on national security issues rarely consider this violence as relevant to national security. But Stephanie argues that we should.

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At this week's Hoover Book Soiree, Rosa Brooks joined Benjamin Wittes to talk about her new book, How Everything Became War and the Military Became Everything: Tales from the Pentagon. The book covers an extraordinary range of territory, from Brooks' personal experiences working as a civilian advisor at the Pentagon, to the history of the laws of war, to an analysis of the U.S. military's expanded role in a world in which the lines between war and peace are increasingly uncertain. 

How should we think about the military’s responsibilities outside the realm of traditional warfare? And is it desirable, or even possible, to rethink the way we approach the distinctions between wartime and peacetime?

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Last week, the National Security Division of the Justice Department celebrated its 10th anniversary by holding a major conference at the Center for Strategic and International Studies. Judge Laurence Silberman, the intellectual and policy force behind the division's creation, spoke about the birth of NSD with Lawfare’s Benjamin Wittes. As co-chair of the so-called Robb-Silberman commission that examined the intelligence failures leading up to the Iraq War, Judge Silberman recommended the creation of the new division. And as a judge on the FISA Court of Review, he also wrote a key opinion breaking down the “wall” between intelligence and law enforcement functions at the Justice Department.

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It's been an unusual election season so far—to put it mildly. Among the many other unexpected or unprecedented occurrences that have taken place over the course of the 2016 campaign season, we've seen many people working in the usually quiet and apolitical national security space take a step into the political limelight. 

This is especially true of Evan McMullin, a former CIA officer and former Chief Policy Director for the House Republican Conference who is now running for president as an independent. Lawfare's Carrie Cordero came on the podcast to interview McMullin on how his experience in national security operations and policy influenced his decision to make a late independent bid for the presidency, and how his career would shape his approach to the important national security issues facing the country.

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